Hi=20all, I=20dont=20normally=20comment=20on=20this=20reflector=20but=20=20I=20think= =20this=2016-9=20or=204-3=20argument will=20soon=20naturally=20die=20away. I=20live=20in=20the=20Uk=20where=20virtually=20all=20receivers=20of=2024"=20= and=20up=20are=2016-9=20and=20have been=20for=20several=20=20years. The=20most=20common=20size=20today=20is=2028",=20a=20typical=20low=20end=20= 28"=2016-9=20sells=20in=20the Supermarket=20Aisle=20for=20$280=20($1.8=3D=A31).=20 I=20dont=20know=20if=20this=20is=20a=20high=20price=20in=20the=20US=20or=20= not.=20The=20next=20most=20popular=20size which=20I=20have,=20is=2032",=20over=20that=20size=20people=20buy=20projec= tion=20or=20Plasma's.=20The price=20is=20falling=20extremely=20rapidly.=20Many=20other=20European=20Co= untries=20are=20the=20same. I=20guess=20while=20the=20CE=20guy's=20can=20sell=20as=20many=2016-9's=20a= s=20they=20can=20make=20outside=20the US,=20the=20US=20is=20a=20convenient=20dumping=20ground=20for=204-3=20sets= =20before=20the=20CE=20guy's finally=20shut=20down=20the=20last=204-3=20CRT=20manufacturing=20Lines.(Al= ready=20extinct=20in=20Japan and=20Europe=20I=20believe) Most=20of=20the=20CE=20guy's=20are=20well=20on=20the=20way=20to=20converti= ng=20to=20LCD=20or=20Plasma=20TV's which=20here=20are=20mostly=2016-9=20except=20in=20the=20Small=20sizes=20(= sub=2020"). Just=20for=20reference=20a=20Free=20view=20box=20(over=20the=20air=20Digit= al=20SD)=20costs=20less=20than $75. It=20is=20still=20for=20some=20reason=20more=20common=20to=20have=20a=20se= parate=20DTT=20tuner=20than integrated. There=20is=20now=20a=20move=20towards=20HDTV=20but=20this=20will=20be=20in= itially=20be=20by=20sattelite. Peter ____________________Reply=20Separator____________________ Subject:=20=20=20=20[opendtv]=20Re:=20(No=20Date:=20Tue,=2028=20Sep=202004= =2010:30:37=20-0400 Author:=20opendtv@xxxxxxxxxxxxx Date:=20=20=20=20=20=20=2025/10/2004=2017:19 At=207:17=20PM=20-0400=2010/24/04,=20Manfredi,=20Albert=20E=20wrote: >Craig=20Birkmaier=20wrote: > >>=20=20You=20STILL=20don't=20get=20it.=2016:9=20is=20a=20DISPLAY=20aspect= >>=20=20ratio.=20It=20may=20well=20dominate=20in=20the=20future. > >Which=20is=20exactly=20what=20the=20Grand=20Alliance=20was=20talking >about,=20Craig.=20When=20they=20proposed=2016:9=20and=20square >pixels,=20guess=20what,=20they=20were=20talking=20about=20the >display.=20Now=20do=20you=20get=20it? NO=20BERT,=20I=20don't=20get=20your=20twisted=20logic. The=20Grand=20Alliance=20and=20ATSC=20have=20absolutely=20NO=20control=20o= ver=20display=20 aspect=20ratios.=20Table=20three=20lists=20the=20constraints=20on=20source= =20aspect=20 ratio=20that=20are=20permissible=20in=20the=20ATSC=20standard.=20=20And=20= the=20FCC=20chose=20 to=20remove=20Table=203=20from=20the=20standard. CE=20manufacturers=20are=20the=20ones=20who=20have=20control=20over=20disp= lay=20aspect=20 ratio.=20There=20are=20NO=20restrictions=20on=20what=20they=20can=20offer=20= in=20terms=20of=20 display=20aspect=20ratio,=20size=20or=20resolution.=20Look=20at=20the=20FC= C=20order=20 mandating=20ATSC=20receivers=20in=20new=20TV=20receivers=20-=20you=20will=20= NOT=20find=20ANY=20 restrictions=20on=20display=20aspect=20ratio. That=20being=20said,=20there=20was=20(and=20still=20is)=20a=20subset=20of=20= both=20 broadcasters=20and=20video=20equipment=20and=20display=20manufacturers=20w= ho=20pushed=20 VERY=20HARD=20for=2016:9.=20Some=20of=20these=20vidiots=20are=20still=20wo= rking=20through=20 the=20ITU=20to=20specify=20that=20ONLY=201080=20lines=20can=20be=20conside= red=20to=20be=20HDTV=20 and=20thus=20used=20as=20an=20international=20standard=20for=20program=20d= istribution. This=20is=20NOTHING=20MORE=20that=20an=20attempt=20to=20control=20the=20ev= olution=20of=20a=20 huge=20market=20through=20control=20of=20supply,=20with=20the=20creative=20= use=20of=20 lawyers=20and=20lot's=20of=20money=20to=20get=20the=20politicians=20to=20c= reate=20the=20 perception=20that=20you=20need=20to=20buy=20a=20new=20TV. It=20has=20nothing=20to=20do=20with=20recognized=20science.=20It=20has=20n= othing=20to=20do=20 with=20the=20reality=20that=20the=20marketplace=20can=20deal=20with=20thes= e=20issues=20 without=20the=20need=20for=20CONSTRAINTS=20that=20favor=20specific=20produ= cts=20and=20 manufacturers. >=20=20>=20Hollywood=20is=20not=20using=2016:9=20Bert,=20except=20for=20so= me >>=20=20shows=20they=20produce=20for=20TV. > >Since=20you=20insist=20on=20repeating=20this=20comment,=20the >most=20common=20ratio=20used=20by=20Hollywood=20is=201.85:1, >which=20for=20all=20intents=20and=20purposes=20is=20the=20same=20as >16:9.=20The=20overscan=20in=20TVs=20easily=20covers=20up=20the >difference.=20So=20there=20is=20no=20mismatch=20issue=20with >Hollywood's=20most=20common=20ratio. Actually=20this=20is=20NOT=20completely=20true.=201.85:1=20may=20still=20d= ominate=20ALL=20 releases,=20but=20it=20does=20not=20dominate=20economically,=20since=20mos= t=20of=20the=20 blockbusters=20use=20wider=20aspect=20ratios.=20=20And=20now=20that=20TV=20= is=20going=20 wider,=20Hollywood=20is=20going=20even=20wider=20to=20differentiate=20itse= lf. > >The=202.35:1=20is=20accommodated=20as=20I=20explained=20above: >either=20with=20distortion=20or=20with=20black=20bars.=20With >a=2016:9=20display=20aspect=20ratio,=20the=20distortion=20or >annoying=20black=20bars=20are=20going=20to=20be=20less=20that=20they >would=20be=20over=20a=20legacy=204:3=20display. Duh... 2.35:1=20is=20but=20one=20of=20several=20hundred=20film=20formats=20shot=20= by=20Hollywood.=20 There=20appears=20to=20be=20growing=20use=20of=202:1,=20and=20other=20aspe= ct=20ratios=20that=20 are=20not=20as=20wide=20as=202.35:1. > >>=20=204:3=20sets=20are=20still=20outselling=20widescreen=20models >>=20=20by=20a=20huge=20factor.=20Yes=20this=20will=20change. > >Finally.=20Thank=20you.=20It=20will=20change=20because=20new >display=20technologies=20don't=20involve=20a=20*cost* >premium=20for=20wide=20aspect=20ratio,=20and=20because=20the >source=20content=20will=20be=20predominately=20wide.=20And >TV=20and=20movie=20content=20is=20*primarily*=20going=20to >be=20viewed=20full=20screen,=20even=20if=20*occasionally* >people=20might=20view=20it=20in=20a=20window. Sorry,=20but=20widescreen=20DOES,=20and=20will=20continue=20to=20come=20wi= th=20a=20cost=20 premium.=20Go=20to=20the=20stores=20and=20look=20around=20Bert.=20Most=20o= f=20the=20CHEAP=20HD=20 capable=20sets=20have=204:3=20not=2016:9=20screens.=20LCD=20and=20plasma=20= displays=20are=20 going=20wide,=20but=20it=20is=20still=20cheaper=20to=20make=20a=204:3=20li= ghtbulb=20than=20a=20 16:9=20lightbulb. >My=20comment=20was=20that=20the=20Grand=20Alliance=20proposal >is=20being=20adopted=20de=20facto,=20and=20I=20see=20that >finally=20you=20have=20come=20to=20the=20same=20conclusion. I=20see=20absolutely=20no=20evidence=20of=20this.=20Please=20let=20me=20kn= ow=20when=2016:9=20 become=20the=20dominant=20(i.e.=2051%=20of=20the=20market)=20aspect=20rati= o=20for=20ALL=20TV=20 displays=20and=20receivers=20sold. Regards Craig =20 =20 ---------------------------------------------------------------------- You=20can=20UNSUBSCRIBE=20from=20the=20OpenDTV=20list=20in=20two=20ways: -=20Using=20the=20UNSUBSCRIBE=20command=20in=20your=20user=20configuration= =20settings=20at FreeLists.org=20 -=20By=20sending=20a=20message=20to:=20opendtv-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx=20wit= h=20the=20word unsubscribe=20in=20the=20subject=20line. 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