[liblouis-liblouisxml] Re: A new liblouis?
- From: "John J. Boyer" <john.boyer@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
- To: liblouis-liblouisxml@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
- Date: Mon, 28 Oct 2013 08:58:48 -0500
Keith,
I've given up the idea of changing the license. Others have made points,
and yours are very good. If people don't want to use something because
of the LGPL that is their problem.
I hope this particular discussion closes.
John
On Mon, Oct 28, 2013 at 12:10:15PM +0000, Keith Creasy wrote:
> Hi all.
>
> I think I may prefer LGPL for LibLouis. It helps to prevent fragmentation and
> more or less forces people who want to make improvements to give those
> improvements back to the community. Please think carefully before you change
> this. We really want people to contribute to the free and open-source
> LibLouis and not take it, improve it, and sell it or even release other
> forked versions of it.
>
>
> Keith
>
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: liblouis-liblouisxml-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> [mailto:liblouis-liblouisxml-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of John Gardner
> Sent: Friday, October 25, 2013 3:15 PM
> To: liblouis-liblouisxml@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> Subject: [liblouis-liblouisxml] Re: A new liblouis?
>
> Very good thought John. I have also had a lot of negative feedback about
> LGPL. It makes a lot of sense to adopt the same license as BrailleBlaster.
>
> John G
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: liblouis-liblouisxml-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> [mailto:liblouis-liblouisxml-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of John J.
> Boyer
> Sent: Friday, October 25, 2013 12:02 PM
> To: liblouis-liblouisxml@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> Subject: [liblouis-liblouisxml] Re: A new liblouis?
>
> Right at the beginning we should decide to use a permissive license such as
> Apache 2.0, which is used by BrailleBlaster, or the MIT license.
> liblouis has been shut out of some uses by the LGPL license. I want any open
> source software that I work on to be as widely available as possible.
>
> John B
>
> On Fri, Oct 25, 2013 at 10:09:59AM -0700, John Gardner wrote:
> > John, details are not as clear as I would like, but it does seem clear
> > that one would need separate scripts for translation (liblouis) and
> > formatting (liblouisutdml).
> >
> > John G
> >
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: liblouis-liblouisxml-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> > [mailto:liblouis-liblouisxml-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of John J.
> > Boyer
> > Sent: Friday, October 25, 2013 10:04 AM
> > To: liblouis-liblouisxml@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> > Subject: [liblouis-liblouisxml] Re: A new liblouis?
> >
> > I am glad that this will be discussed by the community. One advantage
> > of a new development would be that we can use all the things that we
> > have learned over the years.
> >
> > Succession is certainly an issue. I'm 77 and others are also getting
> > old and tired.
> >
> > I hope to hear more technical details on the plans for a new liblouis
> > and liblouisutdml. The two should be kept separate, because many
> > people will want to use liblouis alone, as in a screen reader.
> >
> > John B
> >
> > On Fri, Oct 25, 2013 at 09:25:14AM -0700, John Gardner wrote:
> > > Hello all. John Boyer has been the guiding light of liblouis from
> > > the beginning, and it is hard to imagine the project without him.
> > > But all good businesses need to have succession plans, and it is
> > > hard for many of us to imagine how anybody else could take over the
> > > liblouis project as it now exists. I believe that we should begin a
> > > twin project to remake liblouis and liblouisutdml into something
> > > that uses modern scripting languages that many more people can write
> > > and maintain. I have previously suggested adopting a good
> > > well-known well-supported scripting language so that the translator
> > > for any given language could just be a script. This approach has
> > > many advantages, including the fact that almost anybody can learn a
> > > good scripting language well enough to write and maintain
> > > translators. The project would be big, and it would need to be done
> > > largely by volunteers over time. We would certainly be using the
> > > present system for years. Let me emphasize that I am definitely not
> > > suggesting that present developers divide their time - we cannot
> > > afford that. Any parallel development must
> > be done by other people and by current developers during personal time.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > The problem with scripting languages has always been that they are
> > > typically much slower than good compiled languages. Consequently, a
> > > number of people on this list have objected to such a change. In a
> > > few private discussions with APH developers, we have worked out a
> > > plan that has the advantages of a scripting language, a way to
> > > introduce it without disrupting the way liblouis is currently being
> > > used, and that does
> > not sacrifice speed.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Ken has offered to write up a library that permits one to substitute
> > > a script for the current liblouis table+engine for any given
> > > language, so that as a new script is perfected, it can be slipped in
> > > with no change in any software that uses it. Ken needs to explain
> > > the details
> > though.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > The speed penalty can be minimized by letting any "heavy lifting"
> > > be done by compiled routines, for example a look-up table that will
> > > translate 95% of the words probably faster than the current method.
> > > If necessary, the script can be compiled. If properly made, the
> > > compiled version can run as fast as a hand-coded routine.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > I have proposed using Python as the scripting language, and Michael
> > > Whapples has propposed using it in a controlled manner so that it
> > > can be compiled to C with Cython. I believe that this is a good
> > > approach, and I like it because I am more or less capable of writing
> > > Python, so I would volunteer to start the process by writing a new
> > > translator for
> > Nemeth and UEB.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Okay, it is now time for all you stakeholders to weigh in.
> > > Succession planning is not really an option - we have to do
> > > something. The question really is "What?" We all understand about
> > > the need to keep translation fast and the need not to take up any
> > > significant amount of
> > present developers'
> > > time. What are other issues, and what are other answers to "what?"?
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > John Gardner
> > >
> > >
> > >
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> > --
> > John J. Boyer; President, Chief Software Developer Abilitiessoft, Inc.
> > http://www.abilitiessoft.com
> > Madison, Wisconsin USA
> > Developing software for people with disabilities
> >
> > For a description of the software, to download it and links to project
> > pages go to http://www.abilitiessoft.com
> >
> > For a description of the software, to download it and links to project
> > pages go to http://www.abilitiessoft.com
>
> --
> John J. Boyer; President, Chief Software Developer Abilitiessoft, Inc.
> http://www.abilitiessoft.com
> Madison, Wisconsin USA
> Developing software for people with disabilities
>
> For a description of the software, to download it and links to project pages
> go to http://www.abilitiessoft.com
>
> For a description of the software, to download it and links to project pages
> go to http://www.abilitiessoft.com
> For a description of the software, to download it and links to
> project pages go to http://www.abilitiessoft.com
--
John J. Boyer; President, Chief Software Developer
Abilitiessoft, Inc.
http://www.abilitiessoft.com
Madison, Wisconsin USA
Developing software for people with disabilities
For a description of the software, to download it and links to
project pages go to http://www.abilitiessoft.com
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