Hi Yudit,
The matter of a “bonus” was discussed by another commenter.
I do not believe it appropriate to charge a percentage or to accept a bonus.
I do not even understand the concept – I am either doing my best work, toward
the best outome, or I should not accept the assignment/position.
Lauren
From: Yehudit Dolgin [mailto:ydolginster@xxxxxxxxx] ;
Sent: Monday, 17 January 2022 20:32
To: Lauren Dellar
Cc: Zvi Friedman; Beth Shapiro; Avi Silverman; arnie draiman; Fundraisers Forum
Subject: Re: [Fundraisers Forum] Re: [Fundraisers Forum] Re: % of
donations
But Lauren,
you said:
Any hint of motivation and compensation being linked reflects negatively on our
profession.
Yet it was stated that a bonus is okay. ISn't that compensation in order to
motivate? I also think it's a matter of semantics.
And 50% is unbelievably WRONG if you ask me. Those people who take 50% do it
because that's their pay. They don't get paid a salary. Which is really
disgusting if you ask me.
On Mon, Jan 17, 2022 at 8:02 PM Lauren Dellar <laurengdellar@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
Hi everyone,
Steve’s assertion reflects my own values and experiences working in
development for 37 years.
It is best to negotiate fair compensation for your work with the
organization/client at a level which all parties are comfortable with.
If this is done from the outset, you will be paid for a job well done.
Any hint of motivation and compensation being linked reflects negatively on our
profession.
Lauren
From: frforum-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:frforum-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On ;
Behalf Of Steve Solomon
Sent: Monday, 17 January 2022 19:25
To: Zvi Friedman
Cc: Beth Shapiro; Yehudit Dolgin; Avi Silverman; arnie draiman; Fundraisers
Forum
Subject: [Fundraisers Forum] Re: [Fundraisers Forum] Re: % of donations
And so the discussion continues. First of all, let me be clear that I have
worked in the not for profit sector for over 40 years and in 3 countries. I
have served as CEO and as a Senior Fund Raiser, always involved with
multimillion dollar organizations.
In these many years, I have never met a major donor who would have accepted the
notion that the fundraiser receive 50% of his gift ! If the only way to "get
away " with paying huge commissions is by withholding this information from
your donors, then rest assured that it is a wrong practice. Furthermore,
secrets of this kind always get out and then the organizations reputation is
lost and all the hard work of developing relationships with major donors is
down the drain.
No donor will be happy with a 40-50% split with the fundraiser That's what
makes it unethical.
As for Zvi's example, hiring a new development person and using all or most of
the income raised in year one yo cover start up costs is not at all the
equivalent. The salary has been pre-established. If it takes 2 years for the
revenue to reach the minimum ideal level, that is the start up cost. It is not
the equivalent of paying out 100% to the fundraiser . It is the unfortunate
result of not having developed a donor base on previous years.
On Mon, Jan 17, 2022, 19:04 Zvi Friedman <zvifriedman@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
Beth,
I'll add to the quandary. It's theoretically unethical to pay a fundraiser a
percentage and yet it's not unethical to use 100 % of the monies raised by that
employee to cover the cost of that employee. As an illustration, I worked for
an organization that gave a new fundraiser one year to raise enough money to
cover all the costs associated with said employee. The second year the employee
was expected to at least double the amount they raised in the first year and
continue with increases in subsequent years. That employee was paid a salary
which made it "ethical".
So in English, paying a fundraiser 30% of what s/he raises is unethical but
spending 100% of what they raise on them is not. Bottom line is that Every
fundraiser is paid a percentage of what they raise, the only question is when
it's calculated and who assumes the risk. IT'S ALL SEMANTICS.
On Mon, Jan 17, 2022, 17:56 Beth Shapiro <tafkid1@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
This is a fascinating conversation.
I have been working as a grant writer for a long time. And I know that this is
the practice. I tell prospective clients all the time. "Fundraisers and grant
writers don't work on percentages, it is considered unethical." And I have
never done it, because "it is unethical." But the truth is, I don't quite know
why it is unethical. It used to be that grant writers could add no more than
3% of overhead into a project. Over time funders realized that they were
starving their non profits, and that changed to 10%. I know that there are
people who do work on percentages. (I recently heard about someone who took 50%
of every dollar he raised) I have only ever read one grant contract that
states that you cannot take a percentage.
Again, this is not something I have done, so please don't tell me it is
unethical. I am questioning why we don't do it.
Thanks,
Beth
Image removed by sender.
Beth Shapiro
054-330-5941
בטי שפירא
0543305941
On Mon, Jan 17, 2022 at 5:41 PM Yehudit Dolgin <ydolginster@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
What happens if he makes $20 over the agreed upon amount? $50 - $1000 - at
what point does one say - "THAT is a job well done"???!
On Mon, Jan 17, 2022 at 5:23 PM Avi Silverman <amssilv@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
Steve your advice is always valued.
Thank you
On Mon, Jan 17, 2022, 16:07 Steve Solomon <smsolomon22@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
There is no industry practice per se. I don't know if you are adequately paid,
underpaid or highly compensated.
The idea of an agreed bonus based on exceeding your targets is a good practice.
Determining the amount using Annie's formula is a reasonable approach.
On Mon, Jan 17, 2022, 15:41 Avi Silverman <amssilv@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
Thank you Arnie. You and Steve are in agreement. 50% of monthly salary is
acceptable industry practice?
On Mon, Jan 17, 2022, 13:58 arnie draiman <ajdraiman@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
the acceptable amount is 0. zero. it's not how the profession works!
if you feel you are entitled to a bonus for a job well done, then stipulate a
fair amount - 50% of one month's salary (or whatever). but never ever a
percentage!
arnie draiman
On Mon, Jan 17, 2022 at 1:51 PM FreeLists Mailing List Manager
<ecartis@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
frforum Digest Mon, 17 Jan 2022 Volume: 08 Issue: 001
In This Issue:
[Fundraisers Forum] % of donations
----------------------------------------------------------------------
From: Avi Silverman <amssilv@xxxxxxxxx>
Date: Mon, 17 Jan 2022 13:51:37 +0200
Subject: [Fundraisers Forum] % of donations
Negotiating a contract. Want to stipulate if I raise beyond my assigned
goal, I want a percentage of the extra funds that I raised.
Can anyone share what an acceptable % is to ask?
Also is end of the year bonus standard?
Thanks
------------------------------
End of frforum Digest V8 #1
***************************