Agreed. I support Treesa.
Mary
On Feb 26, 2021, at 3:00 PM, Sheran <sheran@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
Yes, I second that.
From: Karen Saxton <>
Sent: Friday, February 26, 2021 2:41 PM
To: Russ Namitz <>
Cc: boo <>
Subject: [boo] Re: OBOL Moderator
Well, said, Russ! And yes, Teresa does a difficult job well.
On Fri, Feb 26, 2021 at 2:33 PM Russ Namitz <namitzr@xxxxxxxxxxx <>> wrote:
Let's all take a breath.....
I commend Teresa for her efforts and with no disrespect to previous
moderators, myself included, she is one of the best that OBOL has ever seen.
She is a woman, with a history of supporting other women, and that should
immediately qualify and validate her position, especially in regards to the
issue(s) at hand.
She is also balancing a contentious topic/behavior/occurrence where tempers
are high and people are reactionary to the point of volatile.
Teresa, please don't step down. You are under a bit of pressure here
understandably. I sense that you are trying to facilitate a conversation
and dialogue....a very difficult one to mediate.
Sincerely,
Russ Namitz
From: boo-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx <> <boo-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx <>> on behalf of
Teresa Hertzel <teresa.hertzel@xxxxxxxxx <>>
Sent: Friday, February 26, 2021 2:04 PM
To: Brodie Cass Talbott <brodietlewis@xxxxxxxxx <>>
Cc: BOO List <boo@xxxxxxxxxxxxx <>>
Subject: [boo] Re: Fwd: Re: Wow!!
You are saying clearly that you feel I have not done a good job of
moderating OBOL. You give examples and bring up history. How can you do that
on the spur of the moment? Have you been saving this up? This is the first
time you have indicated this to me, and you are choosing to do it publicly.
As you are a member of the OBA Board, I would say you are deliberately
humiliating me. Why? Would you like me to resign as OBOL moderator?
On Fri, Feb 26, 2021 at 3:50 PM Brodie Cass Talbott <brodietlewis@xxxxxxxxx
<>> wrote:
All the more reason I would not be interested in promoting BOO. This
clearly shows the value of a moderated forum, and I hope we can work to
make OBOL a welcoming space for all kinds of birders.
I also want to point out that I was among many that thought Jeff should be
banned, but none of us thought that it was "immediate." He already had a
long series of problematic posts, including calling people "psychos," the
obviously racially charged mention of "moorish sovereigns," and multiple
descriptions of graphic violence in defense of his use of the term
"psycho," none of which had anything to do with birds or birding.
This was all BEFORE he started attacking women on the forum, emailing
people off list, and then threatening to call the police on anyone who
wrote him off-list, as well as telling others that he was interested in
suing me because of my response in support of women.
Any one of these posts should have put him on moderated posts, with the
subsequent post resulting in banning. There was nothing "immediate" about
it.
And if he's allowed to bully people here, I'm out, and would encourage
others to do the same, as a message that the birding community does not
support bullying or sexism.
Brodie
Portland
On Fri, Feb 26, 2021 at 1:38 PM Teresa Hertzel <teresa.hertzel@xxxxxxxxx
<>> wrote:
Brodie, that was not a fair statement. BOO is not moderated.
On Fri, Feb 26, 2021 at 3:37 PM Brodie Cass Talbott
<brodietlewis@xxxxxxxxx <>> wrote:
I found Jeff's email to Linda to be the textbook case of bullying, and am
shocked that it wasn't met with swift condemnation from the moderator. It
encourages him to post more like this, and the women on this list to yet
again have to choose to stay and be the target of bullying, or leave yet
another forum, for self defense.
There was mention of perhaps having the OBA board consider adding this
list to our website. I won't speak for anyone else on the board but I
would have no interest in promoting a list that tolerates this sort of
behavior.
Brodie
Portland
On Fri, Feb 26, 2021, 13:03 Mary Garrard <springazure1@xxxxxxxxx <>>
wrote:
Whether or not we would like someone in person is irrelevant. What’s
relevant is how we treat each other online since that is how we
know each other. I consider Jeff’s email to be a perfect example of
what is not acceptable. First, because the email specifically targeted
someone. I reread her email and she didn’t mention Jeff, but maybe I
missed something. Second, because one feels attacked doesn’t give one
permission to retaliate. That’s how wars get started. Third, if a
response is necessary, it can be stated in such a way that promotes
communication instead of shutting it down.
I leave it to Treesa to decide how to handle it, since she’s the
moderator, and even though BOO doesn’t have the same guidelines as OBOL,
civility is still necessary.
Mary
___________
My religion is very simple. My religion is kindness. The Dalai Lama
On Feb 26, 2021, at 12:45 PM, Jeff Gilligan <jeffgilligan10@xxxxxxxxx
<>> wrote:
Women - You would probably like me. Most do who know me. Most means
over 50%. I take a widow in the neighborhood to Nogales, Mexico to
see her dentist. She is concerned about going on her own (wise). I
spent uncounted hours on a team looking for the Golden State Killer
(aka - East Area Rapist). Our POI (who had ties to Post and
Prineville, Oregon) was taken very seriously by the cold case
detectives, but his sister’s DNA ruled him out. The case looked
incredibly good, so much so that the detectives were surprised and
disappointed. BTW: Dozens of ex-wives and ex-girl friends turned in
their EXs as being the killer. Some reports were in great detail, that
included supposed admissions. They were all debunked, and some were so
convincing that barring DNA analysis, the EX would have possibly been
charged with murders. That is why evidence matters. Recently I got a
very solid lead on the murder of Eliane Fay Lehtinen. The cold case
unit in the Bay Area took (or is taking) it seriously. I am not
optimistic though unless there is DNA evidence:
https://murdermurder.news/2020/07/10/your-next-favorite-podcast-naptime-nancy/
<https://murdermurder.news/2020/07/10/your-next-favorite-podcast-naptime-nancy/>.
It is just not right to accuse some one publicly and make claims,
without first hand knowledge, where there has not been a trial and
conviction. Calling a person who is not a public figure a perpetrator
of a crime of moral turpitude is just wrong, unless there is a
conviction. Even if an innocent man is not charged, or not found
guilty, his reputation will always be damaged.
Women birders should be more concerned about guys like this:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bobby_Jack_Fowler ;
<https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bobby_Jack_Fowler>
orhttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Israel_Keyes ;
<https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Israel_Keyes>. Bobby Fowler worked
about 200 yards from the Boiler Bay wayside. Keyes raped a woman on
the Deschutes River. Both of these guys stalked Oregon birding
locations for a time. Even in the Georgia situation, the purported
victim acknowledges that they were dating. Not even her allegation
would indicate that he is a troll hiding in the woods waiting to waylay
women birders. Indicating his name to protect Oregon women who he is
not dating 3,000 miles away is unnecessary. The first comment on
OBOL, about the board o OBA condemning assaults on women seemed strange
to me, but uncontroversial. I very much doubt that anyone on OBOL
favors violence against women.
If he did what is claimed, he deserves punishment.
Even on this site, I would hope we revert to birding talk.
Jeff Gilligan
On Feb 26, 2021, at 1:09 PM, Teresa Hertzel <teresa.hertzel@xxxxxxxxx
<>> wrote:
Linda and Jeff, please both stay on this listserv. Our biggest
"problem" is our diversity, and BOO is our last hope to figure out how
to get along.
On Fri, Feb 26, 2021 at 1:22 PM Jeff Gilligan
<jeffgilligan10@xxxxxxxxx <>> wrote:
Right. It is nice to have a site where birds can be discussed, and
that is not subject to the thought control bureau, that encourages
false accusations about posters, and has no trouble accusing a not
arrested or charged person (in Georgia) with crimes of moral
turpitude. I will post bird sightings here in the future.
Linda Fink - go take a dump. I can see you are full of it.
( I don’t react rudely, except to the rude and crude.)
Jeff Gilligan
On Feb 26, 2021, at 12:13 PM, canyoneagle (Redacted sender
"canyoneagle" for DMARC) <dmarc-noreply@xxxxxxxxxxxxx <>> wrote:
Absolutely agree with everything Linda said, great note, thank you!
I hung on for six years before giving up on OBOL. A number of
people I know gave up much sooner, and were quite bitter about the
treatment that they received from what Linda called the "old
guard". My name for them was the "Inner Circle". I always thought
that they used OBOL as if it was their own private list, rather
than a list that is open to all bird folks. Perhaps the Inner
Circle should think about starting their own list?
I live in California now, but still enjoy reading Boo, so thank you
Treesa!
I might run into some of you in the field in the future, as I will
be up that way again.
Best wishes all,
Lori Markoff
canyoneagle@xxxxxxxxx <>
-----Original Message-----
From: boo-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx <> <boo-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx <>> On
Behalf Of Linda Fink
Sent: Thursday, February 25, 2021 6:51 PM
To: boo@xxxxxxxxxxxxx <>
Subject: [boo] Wow!!
I checked my email this evening, as usual, and was shocked to see a
whole slew of Boo messages in my daily digest. I have not bothered
to check OBOL for several days as I'm busy living life here on the
farm in the post-ice age times. So I had not read any of the stuff
y'all are talking about. How wonderful to hear such a reasonable
discussion here on Boo!
I'll come down on the side of Caleb. Bullies should be removed.
I've been on OBOL since the early days when it really was just for
rare bird sightings. That is no longer necessary thanks to e-bird.
And, folks, those knowledgeable old guys are not the only ones on
OBOL who are knowledgeable. Others would speak up if the old guard
took their toys and left.
As for what topics should be on OBOL, political discussions still
need to be on BOO. I love having that venue where I know people are
interested in hearing about the conservation issues I post there
(here).
And where I can read about ones I may not have known about yet.
(Thanks, the other Linda!)
And, finally, a million thanks to moderator Theresa. What a fine
and fair job you have always done. I still hate the e-bird reports
that fill up my OBOL digest but I respect that I can scroll (and
scroll and
scroll) past them eventually to get to what I'm interested in,
which is not rare bird sightings but just interesting bird
sightings, like Judy's field trip reports... I always envied having
a group like that birding together.
What OBOL has become by letting the old guard have their way is of
very little interest to me anymore. And I hate hearing people
disparage each other. Joel is always getting into trouble with some
of the old regulars yet Joel is out there doing more for birds and
conservation on a daily basis than most anyone else on OBOL. His
personality, like mine, just ticks some people off. Theresa has a
job keeping us both in line but she is very fair.
When I get time, I'll go back and read the OBOL digests from the
last several days and learn who the bad guys are this time around,
although I think I know. OBOL has never been welcoming to new
birders and so when a new birder comes on and gets shot down, I try
to send them a private email telling them not to let the old guard
get them down. I'm sorry I was not paying attention this time.
Thanks to all of you who have contributed to this discussion and
especially to Theresa for bringing it up. We are so fortunate to
have her as moderator on OBOL!
And, again, please listen to Caleb. Do not put up with crap no
matter how knowledgeable the crapper is.
--
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