James I see your point, but it's the method we should focus on - not the implementation. In other words if you use a break-wire with a FET switch or a break-wire with a flight computer, it shall not be used as an initiator. The consequences of even an experienced HPR flier tripping on such a thing cans do permanent damage Work it backwards and then it is a lot more clear ... It's not a big deal, there are better ways to do this and Jack and I can show you at the next launch -James Sent from my iPhone On Feb 7, 2012, at 8:57 PM, "James Eadie" <eadiefx@xxxxxxxxx> wrote: > Jack, > > I am not trying to “put more into it than what is written,” I am just trying > to understand the new safety code (and by extension, TCC policies.) > > Maybe you can clarify for me. As you said in your earlier post, “A Rocket > Motor Shall not be ignited by any of the following not electronics or av bay > activation or timer activation A Rocket Motor.” So if any of those > electronics, av bays or timers are for airstarting motors, may or may not > they use a pull wire for arming? > > Thanks, > James Eadie > > From: tccrockets-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx > [mailto:tccrockets-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Jack Garibaldi > Sent: Tuesday, February 07, 2012 8:30 PM > To: tccrockets@xxxxxxxxxxxxx > Subject: [tccrockets] Re: Tripoli Rules 2012 > > Interpretate as you will but anyone bringing up a rocket that a motor will be > lit by a pull pin, mercury switch or pressure roller will not be able to fly > it at TCC try not to put more into it than what is written. > > Jack G > > From: tccrockets-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx > [mailto:tccrockets-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Karl Baumheckel > Sent: Tuesday, February 07, 2012 8:08 PM > To: tccrockets@xxxxxxxxxxxxx > Subject: [tccrockets] Re: Tripoli Rules 2012 > > It is probably not safe to have electronics ignite a second stage HPR motor > that doesn't have a minimum altitude arm feature. Not only that but the > electronics should not be armed until the complex rocket is in the upright > position and should be unarmed before laying down the rocket. By the way, > you make a great point James. > > Karl > > > > From: "James Eadie" <eadiefx@xxxxxxxxx> > To: tccrockets@xxxxxxxxxxxxx > Sent: Tuesday, February 7, 2012 7:27:56 PM > Subject: [tccrockets] Re: Tripoli Rules 2012 > > The safety code isn’t worded very well. > > I think what Tripoli intended to say (as touched upon by Owen) is that break > wires may not be used to arm electronics which in turn ignite motors. > > We all know a broken wire in itself is not going to ignite a motor. > > James Eadie > > From: tccrockets-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx > [mailto:tccrockets-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Jack Garibaldi > Sent: Tuesday, February 07, 2012 5:46 PM > To: tccrockets@xxxxxxxxxxxxx > Subject: [tccrockets] Re: Tripoli Rules 2012 > > Under 2-12.6 it says A Rocket Motor Shall not be ignited by any of the > following not electronics or av bay activation or timer activation A Rocket > Motor > > Jack G > > From: tccrockets-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx > [mailto:tccrockets-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Karl Baumheckel > Sent: Tuesday, February 07, 2012 5:23 PM > To: tccrockets@xxxxxxxxxxxxx > Subject: [tccrockets] Re: Tripoli Rules 2012 > > That is a good question. I would say that you could still use a breakwire > for timer activation. And in my opinion this is a more reliable method than > the G switch for what it's worth. > > > > From: "SCOTT B" <triptechb@xxxxxxxxx> > To: tccrockets@xxxxxxxxxxxxx > Sent: Tuesday, February 7, 2012 2:15:59 PM > Subject: [tccrockets] Re: Tripoli Rules 2012 > > Would this include activation of avionics using a breakwire for low > speed/g-force launches, or just using breakwires for lighting motors? > Scotty B. > > --- On Tue, 2/7/12, AiRobert <airobert@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote: > > From: AiRobert <airobert@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> > Subject: [tccrockets] Re: Tripoli Rules 2012 > To: tccrockets@xxxxxxxxxxxxx > Date: Tuesday, February 7, 2012, 11:01 AM > > Yes these are switches used to for launch detect to start a second stage. > > From: tccrockets-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx > [mailto:tccrockets-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Gene Engelgau > Sent: Tuesday, February 07, 2012 8:58 AM > To: tccrockets@xxxxxxxxxxxxx > Subject: [tccrockets] Re: Tripoli Rules 2012 > > I think a launch controller is a type of ignition system. They may be > referring to cluster and staging ignition? But yes, the TCC controller is > great as is... > > -G > > On Tue, Feb 7, 2012 at 8:24 AM, Jack Garibaldi <jackgaribaldi@xxxxxxx> wrote: > I still haven’t read it all but either way our launch system does not use > none of these > > Jack G > > From: tccrockets-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx > [mailto:tccrockets-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Gene Engelgau > Sent: Tuesday, February 07, 2012 5:57 AM > To: tccrockets@xxxxxxxxxxxxx > Subject: [tccrockets] Re: Tripoli Rules 2012 > > It references the switched in regards to motor ignition and seems to refer to > the launch controller: > > 2-12.6 A rocket motor shall not be ignited by any of the following: > a. A switch that uses mercury. > b. “Pull wires” that disconnect or complete a circuit. > c. “Pressure roller” switches > > ---- > > It does not make reference to av-bar arming switches. > > -G > > > > On Mon, Feb 6, 2012 at 8:38 PM, Jack Garibaldi <jackgaribaldi@xxxxxxx> wrote: > Hey All I have attached the 2012 Tripoli sanctioned rules and we are a > Tripoli club so everyone needs to read them, print them carry them or however > you want to help enforce and use our newest rules, I will get time this week > to really study them but I noticed a couple of quick ones like > > Section 2-18 Participation now reads in part: > "Non-HPR Fliers are allowed in the High Power Launch Area if escorted by > a HPR Flier. A HPR Flier may escort and be accompanied by not more than > two (2) non-HPR fliers in the High Power Launch Area. The HPR flier > escort is required to monitor the actions of the escorted non-HPR > fliers, and the escort is fully responsible for those actions and for > the safety of those escorted." > > There are other changes. For example, the use of mercury switches, pull > wires, and roller switches have now been banned. This means there are > various products by different manufactures that can no longer be used > for air-starts. > > > I don’t want to due a review until I have had time to look the complete pages > over. > > Jack G > > > > -- > - Regards > > Gene Engelgau > KI6IBL, NAR 86770 / TRA 12243 - L3 > http://fruitychutes.com - Consumer and Aerospace Recovery Solutions > Like us on Facebook! > Follow us on Twitter! > 408-499-9050 > > > > > -- > - Regards > > Gene Engelgau > KI6IBL, NAR 86770 / TRA 12243 - L3 > http://fruitychutes.com - Consumer and Aerospace Recovery Solutions > Like us on Facebook! > Follow us on Twitter! > 408-499-9050 > > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG - www.avg.com > Version: 8.5.455 / Virus Database: 271.1.1/4193 - Release Date: 02/06/12 > 19:34:00 >