[tccrockets] Re: Bonding Aluminum to Fiberglass
- From: R Dierking <applerocketry@xxxxxxxxxxx>
- To: <tccrockets@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
- Date: Fri, 30 Nov 2012 09:37:27 -0800
Thanks for posting the photos James. Isn't it fun to do stuff like this! I
think the only time I have 'no worries' is when I'm working on a rocket
project. It's better for me than all the drugs the docs are prescribing. Funny
you mentioned the CF splinters. Last time I was messing with a piece of CF I
got a splinter in my hand; the site got very red and my whole hand swelled up.
I think the fibers are treated with formaldehyde or something gnarly. I'll do
some tests on what I'm working on and post the results. Richard Date: Thu, 29
Nov 2012 23:44:48 -0800
Subject: [tccrockets] Re: Bonding Aluminum to Fiberglass
From: jafrado@xxxxxxxxx
To: tccrockets@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
LOL, yeah, me too. But CF is a real mess! Not sure I would want the splinters!
I just think if you're gonna go through all that effort, why put G10 on
it,otherwise use solid aluminum or G10 fins :-)
So, sounds like you're having fun with it...
Maybe try it with some plywood then, it won't be so heavy but would be a
reallystrong and fun to finish!
Here's a picture of the M150 under vacuum, then peeled before sanding.
I'm doing my M165 this year the same way, maybe you should camp out andwe will
do a few "peel sessions" :-)
On Thu, Nov 29, 2012 at 10:38 PM, R Dierking <applerocketry@xxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
If I worked at at place like Dragonplate, I would need a really big lunch box -
you know, for those scrap pieces ;-)
Oh well, I'm using a sheet of 1/8" thick aluminum I bought at a scrap yard at
$5.25 per pound, and left over G-10. Not that I'm cheap (insert joke here);
just want to see if I can build something with this stuff. I'm not even sure
if it will save weight.
I will get the itching kit to see how it works.
I would be interested in the vacuum set-up. Would you please post some
photos?Richard
Sent from my iPad
On Nov 29, 2012, at 9:50 PM, "James Dougherty" <jafrado@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
I think I would break down and buy the whole sheet
:-)http://dragonplate.com/ecart/categories.asp?cID=65
On Thu, Nov 29, 2012 at 8:49 PM, James Dougherty <jafrado@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
Sorry, 1/32" thick G-10 Garolite
http://dragonplate.com/ecart/product.asp?pID=3925&cID=93
Ouch, pricy, I know ...
But If you could design the fins to fit those sheets... man oh man.
On Thu, Nov 29, 2012 at 8:46 PM, James Dougherty <jafrado@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
Richard,What laminates are you using?
I have a vacuum setup I am not using if you want to borrow it.
-james
On Thu, Nov 29, 2012 at 8:36 PM, James Dougherty <jafrado@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
Actually, Richard, disregard, Cotronics is not what you need for this - I see
what you are
doing.http://www.jamestowndistributors.com/userportal/show_product.do?pid=12214
It's an acid wash which chemically alters the surface as you've described.
Very cool! Can you send us a full report?
On Thu, Nov 29, 2012 at 8:30 PM, James Dougherty <jafrado@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
That's exactly what it is, like an etching primer you use for metal.
Get some Cotronics 4540 Machinable aluminum or 4525. I have some
I can give you one at the next launch if you need like pre-kitted 2 oz batches
;-)
On Thu, Nov 29, 2012 at 6:09 PM, R Dierking <applerocketry@xxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
I'm thinking it's acid based to chemically etch the material and also a film so
the aluminum will not oxidize immediately when exposed again to the air. Some
people use wet sanding of the aluminum to prevent the oxidation layer that
prevents good bonding. For this technique, slow cure epoxy (30 minute) is used
and the aluminum surface is wet sanded with the epoxy. I know, it sounds like
a big mess, but it works!
For my application, I'm looking to bond 1/8" thick aluminum between sheets of
1/32" thick G-10 Garolite for fins. The attached photo shows the aluminum test
peice.
Anyway, I'm probably going to try the West Systems Aluminum Etch on some test
pieces and see if I can pull the layers apart.
Richard Dierking
Subject: [tccrockets] Re: Bonding Aluminum to Fiberglass
From: bandman444@xxxxxxxxx
Date: Thu, 29 Nov 2012 17:31:47 -0800
To: tccrockets@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
I don't, when we bonded the aluminum fins to our N5800 rocket we used LOCtite
Hysol 9430 and used a sanding while epoxy on approach. It held to Mach 3 so I
guess it was ok.
The West Systems kit looks interesting.
Bryce Chanes
Sent from my iPhone
On Nov 29, 2012, at 4:51 PM, R Dierking <applerocketry@xxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
Does anyone have experience using the West Systems 860-8 aluminum etch kit for
bonding aluminum to fiberglass?
Richard Dierking
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