Re: checking headers and footers

  • From: Jean Menzies <jemenzies@xxxxxxx>
  • To: jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
  • Date: Tue, 22 Nov 2005 15:42:00 -0700

It depends what application you're in. In Outlook Express where I of course am right now, I think it is giving me pixel counts. I don't care about that. But in Word, it gives me inches. Under Tools, Options and on the General tab, you can select units of measure. I have mine set to inches, but you can choose some strange items. Centimetres, millimetres, and some other kinds of measure. So, if you set it to inches, alt plus delete will report your position relative to the left and top margin of the page. In print view, it ads on the margin measure. In normal view, it calculates from the edge of where the text is starting. For example, in normal view it might say 0 inches from left edge, but if you switch to print view, it adds the size of the margin and you might hear 1.25 inches from left edge.

No, it doesn't tell you row and column like I remember way back in the Dos days when I used WordPerfect. Anyway, that has no meaning anyway when using a proportional font like Times New Roman which is the default in Word.

Hope this helps.

Jean


----- Original Message ----- 

From: "Donna Corson" <donnalettie@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
To: <jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Tuesday, November 22, 2005 3:07 PM
Subject: Re: checking headers and footers


I also like the alt delete command with the Jaws cursor so you know exactly
where you are using the pixels. If you check your left margin with the pc
cursor, does that mean if it says one that it is the first column of the
line? If that line happens to be indented for some reason, wouldn't it
still say column one and the only way you could really know that it was at
the actual margin that you want would be to check the approximate pixel
count.
----- Original Message ----- From: "Jean Menzies" <jemenzies@xxxxxxx>
To: <jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Monday, November 21, 2005 4:59 PM
Subject: Re: checking headers and footers


I think it's a Jaws command. The only way you'd delete something is if
you forgot to press the alt key with it. Smile.

Jean
----- Original Message ----- From: "Yardbird" <yardbird@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
To: <jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Monday, November 21, 2005 1:15 PM
Subject: Re: checking headers and footers


Where does this alt delete command come from?  is it a Windows
keyboard
command, or something to do with Jaws?  And is there no danger of
accidentally deleting something?

----- Original Message ----- From: "Jean Menzies" <jemenzies@xxxxxxx>
To: <jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Monday, November 21, 2005 11:48 AM
Subject: Re: checking headers and footers


Okay. I tried that and yes, it worked. It worked after I created the
header line. Then I could indeed use the alt delete to verify it. I
couldn't tell exactly what was what when I was creating it, but I was
able to check the line after I finished the steps.

So that's twice today I've had to recant on something. Smile. Thanks
for setting me straight.

Jean
----- Original Message ----- From: "G.W. Cox" <gwcox2@xxxxxxxxxxx>
To: <jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Monday, November 21, 2005 12:45 PM
Subject: Re: checking headers and footers


You said, "it's hard to determine alignment." If you need to check
where
it is , use alt delete.
----- Original Message ----- From: "Jean Menzies" <jemenzies@xxxxxxx>
To: <jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Monday, November 21, 2005 11:20 AM
Subject: Re: checking headers and footers


No, that doesn't give you the exact placement of the text.  It only
tells you left aligned, font size, etc.  It doesn't say 2.3 inches
from
left margin, etc.

Jean
----- Original Message ----- From: "G.W. Cox" <gwcox2@xxxxxxxxxxx>
To: <jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Monday, November 21, 2005 11:09 AM
Subject: Re: checking headers and footers


You can check alignment in the creation stage with insert F, just as
you
might in normal view.
----- Original Message ----- From: "Jean Menzies" <jemenzies@xxxxxxx>
To: <jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Monday, November 21, 2005 10:54 AM
Subject: Re: checking headers and footers


Yes, that's about it, but still when I creat one, it's hard to
determine
alignment even in the creation stage. Sometimes I do have to edit
them.

Jean
----- Original Message ----- From: "Yardbird" <yardbird@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
To: <jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Monday, November 21, 2005 10:28 AM
Subject: Re: checking headers and footers


Jean, you'll just have to go into the screens where you created the
headers
and footers to check for this. If they're set as you remember
having
set
them, then they're fine. I know that's not as easy as the way a
sighted
person would simply look at the screen and see the positions, but
so
it
goes. To tell the truth, once I create a footer or header,
carefully,
and
apply it to the document, I just trust that it's appearing as it
should.
I've never been disappointed in this, so, again, if you create your
headers
carefully, it'll be fine. For a sighted user, it's just reassuring
to
see a
header actually appear above the body text. It just looks nifty to
see how
the document will actually look. But for a Jaws user, just being
very
careful in the first place should be enough.

hing is going tnduser['re ish,
----- Original Message ----- From: "Jean Menzies" <jemenzies@xxxxxxx>
To: <jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Monday, November 21, 2005 9:11 AM
Subject: checking headers and footers


But I have a problem using the Jaws cursor to check headers and
footers
in print view in Word.

For example, I can certainly read the text of the header or footer,
but
I can't check alignment. Typically, I have some text of a header
that
I
want left justified, and another part that needs to be right
justified.
. I'd like to be able to use a command like alt-delete to
determine
the
relationship to the margin. But you can't do that with the Jaws
cursor.

Same goes when creating the header.  I find it difficult to
determine
exact text placement.

Jean

----- Original Message ----- From: "Yardbird" <yardbird@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
To: <jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Monday, November 21, 2005 10:07 AM
Subject: Re: fs clipboard problem


You're welcome. As I said, Jaws won't perceive and report on the
actual
appearance in certain ways, but that doesn't really matter, for
the
most
part. But as I said, elements like headers (and simply page
numbers
added
from the Insert menu, also) will appear on the screen so you can
check
them
rather than having to go into the headers screen to confirm that
you've set
them. But for that, you'll need to use the Jaws cursor, so far as
I
remember from the last time I checked headers in the print view.
The
virtual cursor won't see headers, I don't think. Give it a try.
It
will
provide at least a little assurance that things are coming out as
you
want
them to.
----- Original Message ----- From: "Korin Trytko" <gryffontko@xxxxxxxxxxx>
To: <jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Monday, November 21, 2005 8:45 AM
Subject: Re: fs clipboard problem


Hi Yardbird,

Thanks for that last bit.  I like   to know How my document will
look
when
it is printed out.  It's  a good thing to know.  I don't always
have
someone
to check my work and the more I am able to figure out myself the
better.

thanks again

Korin Trytko


----- Original Message ----- From: "Yardbird" <yardbird@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
To: <jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Monday, November 21, 2005 7:38 AM
Subject: Re: fs clipboard problem


Hi Dave,

I'm an old Word user and I'm partially sighted, so I can confirm
this. I
hope others will profit from this advice. Even though the Normal
View is
best to use for Jaws to have the clearest view of the document
most
of the
time, the Print View provides an understanding of how the hard
copy
will
actually look. Although the difference can't be fully
appreciated
without
sight, Jaws will report usefully on some things, such as headers,
which
appear in Print View, but are not displayed in Normal View.

----- Original Message ----- From: "Dave Speck" <dspeck@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
To: <jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Monday, November 21, 2005 6:24 AM
Subject: Re: fs clipboard problem


Actually, JAWS users can benefit from knowing if they are in the
Print
view
or Normal view.  Do this in both views and listen to the
resulting
information.

Press Alt+Delete to hear the cursor's distance from the left and
top
margins.
Press Jawskey+Delete to hear the current line and column.

If the user is particular about formatting, it is very important
even
when
the screen can not be seen.

Regards,

Dave



----- Original Message ----- From: "Yardbird" <yardbird@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
To: <jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Saturday, November 19, 2005 9:00 PM
Subject: Re: fs clipboard problem


Well, that's irrelevant, here, which is why I couldn't have
guessed
it.
The
print view is simply one of the alternatives on the View menu as
to
how
the
document will be shown on the screen. It looks more or less the
way
the
doc
will look when it's printed out. The sides darken and come in a
little
so
you can see the document as if it were a sheet of printed paper,
the
page
numbers or headers you've set will show visually on the screen
(the
Jaws
cursor can find them, also) instead of remaining hidden as in
"normal
view," 
and some other things.  It's a useful preview of how your
document
is
going
to look when printed, pretty much useless and meaningless if you
can't
see
it. The usual recommendation with Jaws is to just set the View
menu
to
show 
the "normal view," which I put in quotes because I don't really
know
what
they mean, except maybe "unenhanced."

anyway, it doesn't make any difference in any other way, except
that
for
a
Jaws user it's better to work with the normal view, they say,
You
can
always set it to Print View if someone wants to see how it'll
look
printed, 
but if no one's looking, it scarcely matters.  The ultimate
result,
whether
on the computer or printed out, is completely unaffected by this
print/normal thing. That's just a display convenience.

I hope maybe this is helpful.  And I have no idea why this
person's
Jaws
is 
even saying "print," any more than I did in the first place.
Jaws
doesn't
say "print" anytime I can think of.  On the view menu, it says
"pprint
view," which is what is sritten there.  And when you issue the
print
command, it jus says "print."  But you can't be copying and
pasting
text
when you're in the midst of printing a document.

Scratching head, going back to kitchen to eat dinner.

From: "Bruce Toews" <DogRiver@xxxxxxxx>
To: <jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Saturday, November 19, 2005 5:33 PM
Subject: Re: fs clipboard problem


I think that refers to the print view, as opposed to the normal
view. And
about that I know absolutely nothing beyond what I've just said.
<GRIN>

Bruce

--
Bruce Toews
E-mail and MSN/Windows Messenger: DogRiver@xxxxxxxx
Web Site (including info on my weekly commentaries):
http://www.ogts.net
Info on the Best TV Show of All Time: http://www.cornergas.com

On Sat, 19 Nov 2005, Yardbird wrote:

> Why is Word saying "Print" at all in this scenario? You're
> copying and
> pasting text, not printing a document. Do I misunderstand
> what
> you are
> doing at times like this? Thanks for explaining.
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Nicki Keck" <favorite.blend@xxxxxxxxxxx>
> To: <jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> Sent: Saturday, November 19, 2005 3:03 PM
> Subject: Re: fs clipboard problem
>
>
> For me, it is Word. I will use FS clipboard to select, copy,
> and
> append
> the
> text I want to put in, then control-V. All works fine. > then,
sometimes,
> I
> will select another area, press controlC, word will pause, > and
> then
> just
> say
> "print" and go back to the document without saying "copied."
> Yesterday
I 
> had to select again and press control C multiple times (with
> answering
yes
> each time) for it to copy the new text. Now usually, it > works
> just
great, 
> but sometimes, it gets a bit sluggish and flaky when I've had
> Word
> up
for 
> a
> while, something I have to do with my job.  i just think it
> would
> be a
> nice
> thing to have a way of just clearing the clipboard without
> having
> to
> try
> to
> copy something else and answer yes.
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Jean Menzies" <jemenzies@xxxxxxx>
> To: <jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> Sent: Saturday, November 19, 2005 11:17 AM
> Subject: Re: fs clipboard problem
>
>
>> Sorry, but I don't think it's the FS clipboard that's messed
>> up.
>>
>> One thing you might want to check is how your system is
>> displaying
>> highlighted text.  I don't know if that has anything to do
>> with
>> it,
>> but
>> it
>> might.  Of course, you know how to select individual words,
>> sentences,
>> etc., right?
>>
>> And depending where you are trying to use the clipboard,
>> there
>> are
>> clipboard settings in Word you might want to turn off.  I
>> can't
remember
>> what they are right now, but the MS clipboard might be set >> up
differently
>> on your computer. And I have no idea if it's Word you're
>> working
>> in
>> or
>> not.
>>
>> But again, I really don't think the FS clipboard is the
>> problem
>> here.
>>
>> Jean
>>
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: "Sun Sparkle" <sunshine@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>> To: <jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>> Sent: Friday, November 18, 2005 10:45 PM
>> Subject: Re: fs clipboard problem
>>
>>
>>> you know folks this is getting more and more anoying.
>>> the only way to even get the clipboard contents to do what >>> i
>>> would
>>> wantis
>>> to do a select all before doing a control c lets just say
>>> that
>>> is
>>> screwed
>>> up in the sense cause what if you wanted to just select >>> part
>>> of
>>> what
you
>>> are selecting and the regular clipboard and the fs >>> clipboard
>>> dont
allow 
>>> you to copy the text like that then what?
>>> just a question
>>> fs needs tofix there mess up on the fs clipboard.
>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>> From: "Nicki Keck" <favorite.blend@xxxxxxxxxxx>
>>> To: <jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>>> Sent: Friday, November 18, 2005 7:36 PM
>>> Subject: Re: fs clipboard problem
>>>
>>>
>>>> Sometimes, it doesn't copy when I do this.  sometimes, it
>>>> needs
>>>> to
>>>> be
>>>> done multiple times.
>>>>
>>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>>> From: "Bruce Toews" <DogRiver@xxxxxxxx>
>>>> To: <jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>>>> Cc: <Jawslite@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>>>> Sent: Friday, November 18, 2005 7:40 PM
>>>> Subject: Re: fs clipboard problem
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> Why would you need to clear it? Just do a normal cut or
>>>>> copy
>>>>> to the
>>>>> clipboard and a dialog pops up warning you that this will
>>>>> erase
what's 
>>>>> already there, if you've used windows+C. Answer yes to
>>>>> this
>>>>> and
you're 
>>>>> good to go.
>>>>>
>>>>> bruce
>>>>>
>>>>> --
>>>>> Bruce Toews
>>>>> E-mail and MSN/Windows Messenger: DogRiver@xxxxxxxx
>>>>> Web Site (including info on my weekly commentaries):
>>>>> http://www.ogts.net
>>>>> Info on the Best TV Show of All Time:
>>>>> http://www.cornergas.com
>>>>>
>>>>> On Fri, 18 Nov 2005, Sun Sparkle wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> how do you clear what is on the FS clipboard, after
>>>>>> pasteing
>>>>>> what
you
>>>>>> have either in a document, or email?
>>>>>> for the past 6 weeks i have had to unload JAWS to clear
>>>>>> the
>>>>>> FS
>>>>>> clipboard and find this very anoying!
>>>>>> so how do you fix this!
>>>>> --
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