[geocentrism] Re: Moving Earth deception
- From: "philip madsen" <pma15027@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
- To: <geocentrism@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
- Date: Fri, 10 Aug 2007 12:52:48 +1000
Well Marc, you just shot down my imagery of the geocentric universe according
to Phul. What power other than supernatural could cause the sun to move north
and south every year? Seeing as I cant have it locked into some aetheric goo.
Phil.
----- Original Message -----
From: marc-veilleux@xxxxxxxxxxxx
To: Geocentric
Sent: Friday, August 10, 2007 11:28 AM
Subject: [geocentrism] Re: Moving Earth deception
The stars that are on the same plane than the Sun are the 12 constellations
known as the zodiac. Astrolog use them to tell you what the devil wants them
to. Those stars as all other stars or other "things" in the cosmos ... don't
follow the Sun's path (ecliptic). They remain at their respective "right
ascension" (latitude) except for tiny movements as aberration and parallaxes.
Marc V.
----- Original Message -----
From: philip madsen
Sent: 9 août 2007 17:04
To: geocentrism@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: [geocentrism] Re: Moving Earth deception
Philip,
If you always looked at the Moon, didn't you ever noticed that it's highest
point in the sky is variable ?? Just as the Sun is at his highest point in
summer and it's lowest point in winter, so is it with the Moon and the planets:
their orbits always stay within the Ecliptic (that is approximatly 23 degrees
south or north of the equator). Marc.
Cant say I took much notice Marc, even tho I assumed as much.. however ..
This is why I asked, did the stars that are on the same plane, also follow this
annual track..
Philip
----- Original Message -----
From: marc-veilleux@xxxxxxxxxxxx
To: Geocentric
Sent: Thursday, August 09, 2007 12:14 PM
Subject: [geocentrism] Re: Moving Earth deception
Philip,
If you always looked at the Moon, didn't you ever noticed that it's
highest point in the sky is variable ?? Just as the Sun is at his highest
point in summer and it's lowest point in winter, so is it with the Moon and the
planets: their orbits always stay within the Ecliptic (that is approximatly 23
degrees south or north of the equator). Only the comets can be seen outside of
the Sun's path.
Marc V.
----- Original Message -----
From: philip madsen
Sent: 7 août 2007 03:29
To: geocentrism@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: [geocentrism] Re: Moving Earth deception
Philip,
The sphere of the cosmos doesn't move 23 degrees north and 23 degrees
south (for a total of 46 degrees annually) relative to the Earth ! It is the
Sun that moves north - south (total of 46 degrees); HC men claim this is an
illusion caused by the tilted Earth. So in GS it is against all observations
to claim that the sphere of the cosmos moves north south (total 46 degrees)
because we don't observe any annual change (north- south) in the latitude of
the stars except for the very tiny aberration.
Marc V. Before I answer, I did not mean what any angular motion
which degrees might suggest. I meant that the entire universe annually moved in
a parallel fashion, what ever else it was doing, from the tropic of cancer to
the tropic of capricorn and back annualy. Whats that ? A thousand miles back
and forth per year.. Now here is why I asked the stupid question,
Marc, I havn't got a clue what happens. I have monovision, and I
cannot tell where the stars are moving, except east to west.. That is why I
asked Neville if the stars also move north and south with the sun.. somebody
may have took a time lapse movie?? In 75 years I suppose I would not have
gazed at the stars or seen them for more than 6 or 7 times, and then passed it
up after 5 to 10 minutes.. Now the moon, thats different.. I always look at
the fascinating moon.. sometimes, and I'm not joking, if my dog is in the
mood, we howl at the full moon together.. I can do a good wolf howl..
Why would I do that.? When very young my mother told me that when ever
you heard a dog howl, it meant someone had died near by...
No one believes that today, but it sure gets all the neighbourhood dogs
howling...
Now as far as I can remember I seemed to get the impression that the
Southern cross, which is the only star system I seeked out, did go south in our
winter....but of course with such a memory I canna be sure.
Now on another subject to all.. while the phads are on vacation.
A problem here in this group is, that we never know when someone gives
a talk, whether they is talking HC or GS. I prefer to talk HC because that is
what I was tort and understand. When I talk GS I try to make that clear.
Whenever I look at the sun or moon, I have always felt as a "real feeling"
that I am with the ground upon which I stand moving towards and past these
objects. Just like the car going past the telegraph pole. ,,, such is the power
of lifelong indoctrination. The moon is like a lamp post one is driving past.
This is why I cannot relate at all to Allen and others who say that
they see the sun rise towards us, and believe it is the reality. Oh yes I can
understand why they think that, if they have not been educated in the basic
system of heliocentrism taught to them, along with all of the other physical
sciences that support it. But Allen, in his zeal, no doubt denies observation,
when he disallows what is observed from a ship at sea in a tidal current, when
the ship seems to be moving forward through the water, at 15 knots, when in
reality it is not.
Therefore my approach to geocentrism is always as the devils advocate,
when I debate it here.
I see two groups opposed.
One group composing of Paul alone, who "feels" reality the same way as
I did, but who is faithful to that belief beyond reason, subject only to the
concensus of the world of man, which I am not; and the other group, the rest,
who feels an opposite reality, and is also faithful to their belief, beyond
scientific reason, because they are subject to the command of a higher order.
Now I being also subject to the command of a higher order, accept and
believe beyond reason a reality that does not conform with what I have always
seen felt and believed before. I say beyond reason, meaning scientific
reasoning.
From the view of rational science as accepted by the world, even though
this may be politically manipulated, we of the Gs camp are on the defensive.
Being so, does not excuse the seemingly uncharitable manner in which we often
if not always, try to put down Paul's efforts to understand our beliefs, and or
even dispute them. After all, we all should wonder that he has stayed so long
listening, to what I would have said not so many long years ago, a bunch of
silly old people who still believe that the world is flat.
Why are the geocentrists here? Each person must examine his own reason.
I am here for two scientific reasons. One is to gain as much knowledge
as possible that scientifically supports a geocentric universe, and answers or
presents flaws in the current HC one that dominates the world. In other words I
allow for modification or reversal of my own preconceived ideas. Once convinced
I would pass this on to my 2000 odd list. If we do not pass it on we are just
useless einsteins.
The other reason is to make whatever contribution my intellect can
offer towards our understanding of the physics involved. My first way to do
this is to seek out and destroy any flaws I perceive in, or objections that
others might offer against our case. This is the devils advocate. It is also a
way that my preconcieved ideas get modified, that is by the reaction it
creates.
I have in my files an enormous amount of information presented by
Sungenis, Daly , Hertz, De Bouw, etc, and including the Biblical and church
side. to boot, both Catholic and Protestant. None has given to me a
satisfactory conclusion that answers the scientific problems geocentrism
provides. Even GWW which I do not have, if it had the answer, could have
provided it in one simple essay of no more than the length of this post. and if
presented, the world would have to notice
Finally I hope we all do enjoy each others company, pagan or not,
hoping that all may arrive at perfect truth, the only way to eternal happiness
for the people of God, and even temporal satisfaction for the pagans in the
hope that Grace may make that eternal for them; with that charity demonstrated
by Jesus Christ, when he associated with sinners.
Neville has most assuredly to be admired for his example of
non-bigotary, in opening the forum to all reasonable discussion of
sociopolitical and religious discussion, insisting as he has only on charitable
good manners.
I do not pray for anything other than that Gods will be done, but I
hope it to be done in you all.
Philip.
----- Original Message -----
From: marc-veilleux@xxxxxxxxxxxx
To: Geocentric
Sent: Tuesday, August 07, 2007 12:40 PM
Subject: [geocentrism] Re: Moving Earth deception
Philip,
The sphere of the cosmos doesn't move 23 degrees north and 23 degrees
south (for a total of 46 degrees annually) relative to the Earth ! It is the
Sun that moves north - south (total of 46 degrees); HC men claim this is an
illusion caused by the tilted Earth. So in GS it is against all observations
to claim that the sphere of the cosmos moves north south (total 46 degrees)
because we don't observe any annual change (north- south) in the latitude of
the stars except for the very tiny aberration.
Marc V.
----- Original Message -----
From: philip madsen
Sent: 4 août 2007 17:48
To: geocentrism@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: [geocentrism] Re: Moving Earth deception
Walter van der Kamp used such assumed association of stars with the
Sun to deduce a 58-light-day radius (it may have been 60
Well yes, I can see why he might have even with the complications
that might raise. .. But may I add some thoughts.. as it applies to the
celestial poles..
First up, in the GS system the earth is not tilted, but stands tall
vertical and Proud. The tilt is an invention necessary to explain the seasons
in the HC universe (no one seems to have mentioned this)
In this perspective, with this orientation of the earth, as the
sphere of the cosmos moves North and South with its annual oscillation, will
the changing distance change the angle of view (which causes the polar star to
circle) in the same manner as what we see. Also Our system does not provide a
base line for the geometry to measure distance (of the polar star) , as perhaps
the HC system did. But maybe the distance travelled vertically as measured
against the latitudes of the earth, relative to the angle of the cone, as
viewed from the pole, might give you something to work with.. Trig is tricky
like that.. in establishing the distance to the polar star. I never did much
with cones.
Phil.
----- Original Message -----
From: Neville Jones
To: geocentrism@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Sent: Sunday, August 05, 2007 12:41 AM
Subject: [geocentrism] Re: Moving Earth deception
Philip,
Further to my previous answer, and in terms of a scientific
response, I would add that Walter van der Kamp used such assumed association of
stars with the Sun to deduce a 58-light-day radius (it may have been 60, I do
not recall exactly) for the universe. This is based upon the phenomenon of
yearly aberration.
He may well be right. As with the aether, I have not decided on
which side of this fence to position myself yet.
Neville.
Philip,
I don't know why. It's just a feeling. That's why I placed
'better' in quotation marks. Not a very scientific answer is it?!
Neville.
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