[amc] Re: FW: Letters of Support Re: Hyattsville Mennonite Church

  • From: "Ray Gingerich" <RGingerich@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
  • To: "Austin Mennonite Church" <amc@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
  • Date: Sun, 5 Mar 2006 15:31:21 -0600

More thoughts, not thoroughly examined or reflected upon:

I think "scripture" is hard to defend since it is not of one voice, but many. Jesus may have told the woman to "go and sin no more," but he never made an exhaustive list of what acts were sins and what were not. He himself broke several Levitical laws, some of which were punishable by death. I think it would also be hard to conclude unequivocally on what Jesus would say and do now. Also, in spite of Jesus' challenge to Jewish law, while his principles (Love God, love your neighbor as yourself) were timeless, I think his applications of those principles were influenced by time and place. Therefore, like Paul, he may have thought that homosexuality was a choice which current evidence suggests is not the case.

I still think we could find a way to apply Jesus' two-principle summary of "all of the law and the prophets" in this situation. And while the MCUSA and the conferences, may have the "right" to decide who it includes and excludes as member congregations, we also have the right to agree or disagree, even if disagreeing bears some unpleasant consequences including exclusion.

Also, I think that sometimes "leaders" face more constraints on leading than "followers"--i.e., politically, "followers" are in a less vulnerable position to lead than the "leaders" are.

Quite frankly, it would not surprise me if a contemporary Jesus, when asked, "who is my neighbor" may have told a story about a devout Christian being robbed and left for dead. A Mennonite peace activist on his way to a Habitat for Humanity project passes him by, as does Jerry Falwell on his way to a prayer breakfast, etc. Along comes a homosexual Islamist who is moved to compassion...etc.

I don't hold any of the above thoughts tightly and am quite willing to give them up if better ones emerge.

Ray


----- Original Message ----- From: "Steve Friesen" <Friesen@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
To: "Nevitt D. Reesor" <reesor@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>; "Austin Mennonite Church" <amc@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Sunday, March 05, 2006 8:53 AM
Subject: [amc] Re: FW: Letters of Support Re: Hyattsville Mennonite Church



Thanks for those observations, Nevitt. I'll just add a quick comment (have
to get ready for church :-)


 I also think, however, that this is a
difficult position to defend scripturally. My suspicion is that those
who claim that scripture does not treat homosexuality as a sin have
to resort to a lot of rather fancy footwork and very careful
"analysis" of particular passages. Personally, I would "defend" it
through a rather skeptical and deconstructive theological view that
leaves most of Christian theology in smoking ruins. So, my view will
not be much help toward dealing with the conference.

People often describe a welcoming theology as "not taking the bible literally" or "explaining the bible away". I don't think that's accurate. Everyone selects; everyone has to choose. It's the nature of the game.

Biblical arguments against homosexuality tend to select passages about
homosexuality and take those passages literally. But they usually don't
take others literally: ban on pork, ban on images of God, what to do when
there's mold in your house, women covering their heads in worship, only men
teaching men, approval of slavery, polygamy, etc. So the question is, *how*
do you take the bible seriously? Where do you put your focus? And *how* do
you decide where to put your focus?


Mennonites have a mixed track record on this score. We have a brilliant
record on things like focusing on compassion, and on community discernment
in the spirit. At the same time we have a dismal record in our tendency to
define particular clothing or tools as worldly or righteous.


That doesn't answer the question, does it?  At least it ssuggests that we
need lots of community discussion on issues like this in order to work out
an appropriate position.

My opinion: I think that because of what we've learned from science and
other kinds of research, we should say that we Christians were wrong to call
homosexuality a sin and repent from the oppression we have caused. I think
it's appropriate now to hold that the biblical ideals of faithfulness apply
to both straights and gays. I have also experienced that this kind of
affirming congregational stance brings lots of rich resources into the
church. Exclusion makes us weaker.


Steve


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Austin Mennonite Church, (512) 926-3121 www.mennochurch.org
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