As I wrote yesterday, if you reject the 3rd axiom then you need to show us how any agent can come to know the meaning of symbols from knowing only the forms of those symbols, or from knowing only form-based rules for manipulating those symbols. I.e., you need to show us how syntax *is* sufficient for semantics. Despite lots verbiage from you over two days, you have not offered anything remotely resembling an answer. (Not surprising, as no answer exists.) You should admit your error and affirm the 3rd axiom. -gts ========================================== Need Something? Check here: http://ludwig.squarespace.com/wittrslinks/