Hi Arun,
There are no generic answers to your questions.
Here is what YOU have to do, to find the answers for your own questions:
1. Select a material from a particular manufacturer - something like
recommended FR408HR from Isola. Make sure that the material has specs with
Dk & Df identified at least at one frequency point - something like that
http://www.isola-group.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/12/FR408HR-High-Performan
ce-Laminate-and-Prepreg-Data-Sheet-Isola.pdf
2. Define stackup and signal traces (cross-section) - it is dependent on the
material selection.
3. Use a validated field solver to simulate signal propagation for a
particular segment length, frequency range, rise time, data rate,... and
make conclusions for a particular component or compliance specs.
This is just a preliminary approximate analysis with the uncertainty of the
manufacturing and conductor roughness effect. For more accurate analysis,
the dielectric model has to be confirmed or corrected and the conductor
roughness model has to be identified (see for instance #2014_03 or other
relevant articles at http://www.simberian.com/AppNotes.php).
Best regards,
Yuriy
Yuriy Shlepnev, Ph.D.
President, Simberian Inc.
2629 Townsgate Rd., Suite #235, Westlake Village, CA 91361, USA
Office +1-702-876-2882; Fax +1-702-482-7903
Cell +1-206-409-2368; Virtual +1-408-627-7706
Skype: shlepnev
www.simberian.com
Simbeor - Accurate, Productive and Cost-Effective Electromagnetic Signal
Integrity Software
2010 and 2011 DesignVision Award Winner, 2015 Best In Design&Test Finalist
-----Original Message-----
From: si-list-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:si-list-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On
Behalf Of Muhamed Semic
Sent: Friday, February 24, 2017 5:40 AM
To: ArunKumar.K@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx; si-list@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: [SI-LIST] Re: Propagation delay Vs Speed(edge rate)
25mm.
-----Original Message-----
From: si-list-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:si-list-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On
Behalf Of Arun Kumar K
Sent: 24 February 2017 13:27
To: si-list@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: [SI-LIST] Re: Propagation delay Vs Speed(edge rate)
Hi All,
Thanks for your input.
Still I am not clear with this point.
For the better understanding.
For the 10inch routed track in FR4 pcb, what will be the maximum allowable
speed?
For 5GHz what will be the maximum allowable track length?
Both are same question.
Rise time and fall time are depends on Driver. If my understanding is
correct.
Correct me if I am wrong.
This question is also confusing me. For 0.1ns rise time what will be the
maximum allowable track length?
Arun Kumar K
-----------------------------------------------------------
Arun
They are not related. Rise time relates to the driver electronics that
creates the signal. Propagation delay is related to the dielectric constant
of the media that the signal is traveling through.
Much like in audio, attack time for an instrument is unrelated to the time
the sound propagates through air.
Scott McMorrow, CTO Signal Integrity Group Samtec Office 401-284-1827 |
+1-800-726-8329 www.samtec.com<http://www.samtec.com>
------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: Ramani Tatikola [mailto:rtatikola@xxxxxxxxx]
Sent: Friday, February 24, 2017 6:38 PM
To: Arun Kumar K
<ArunKumar.K@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx<mailto:ArunKumar.K@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>>
Subject: Re: [SI-LIST] Propagation delay Vs Speed(edge rate)
Hello Arun,
Tx delay is based on physical length of the line. Edge rate is time domain
parameter.
Delay and edge rate are connected by Frequency and Time relationship and you
can find them in any text book on Electromagnetics.
Regards,
Ramani
From: Arun Kumar K
Sent: Friday, February 24, 2017 11:54 AM
To: si-list@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: Propagation delay Vs Speed(edge rate)
Hi All.
I am having small doubt about in Transmission Line, between Propagation
delay and Speed(edge rate).
How we can relate the propogation delay and speed(edge rate)?
How to relate the Speed of the singal and propogation length (Transmission
line length) ?
How to relate the above prameter for the analog signals (slow edge rate)?
Arun Kumar
L&T Technology Services Ltd
www.LntTechservices.com<http://www.lnttechservices.com/>
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