I am working on HFSS simulation and associated mesh settings for a what I am
calling the "Mesh-Challenger". Essentially it is a graduated coplanar
microstrip. Most of the EDA tools fall apart fairly fast in either memory
usage, simulation time, and/or accuracy if you use adaptive auto-meshing.
Yuriy Shlepnev demonstrated Simbeor simulation correspondence to measurement
years ago on a very similar structure using an older WRT product CMP-32, see
his or WRT website for resulting report. The structure is located on one of
latest Channel Modeling Platforms CMP-50, a joint project with Isola using
Itera-MT40 material. On a side note, we are really liking this material and
steering our customers towards that solution versus Meg-6. The Bereskin IPC
methods of material identification, as used by Isola, are much closer to
material model fit values in HFSS. Isola is obviously treating support for
signal integrity seriously, and our support for upcoming 70GHz products has
been really great.
Ill be writing up my findings and will be starting with fairly crude box
settings and evolve the solution from there and make that available. The
structure fits a class of structures that are planar in nature, but challenging
for the meshing. Related structures could be coplanar waveguides, coupled
systems, and edge launches that launch into microstrip, for example.
Scott McMorrow really understands this challenging issue of simulator setup
(great job on the Speak Geek on this topic) and will request he review it and
make any suggestions. It is a really challenging problem because the EDA
companies fix and change things really fast, and what worked 4 years ago may
not work now, or work for a different set of challenges.
- Al Neves
-----Original Message-----
From: si-list-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx <si-list-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> On Behalf Of
Cristian Gozzi
Sent: Thursday, May 27, 2021 10:18 PM
To: scottmcmorrow@xxxxxxxxx
Cc: SI-LIST <si-list@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>; ambasananikita@xxxxxxxxx
Subject: [SI-LIST] Re: De-embedding in HFSS, length and accuracy
Great presentation Scott and Rickard
A lot of people use to forget the importance of correct usage and settings of
ports in HFSS and how it impacts the accuracy
You may think to do another one based on the proper setting of adaptive mesh
based on the application and frequency of interest… many people use to do
mistakes here as well, especially when they switch from tools that use fixed
mesh refinement and then they try the same settings in HFSS
Thanks for your contribution and for sharing your knowledge with everyone
Regards
Cris
On Thu, May 27, 2021 at 8:20 PM Scott McMorrow <scottmcmorrow@xxxxxxxxx>
wrote:
Start here and watch the video. This is a presentation I did last week
with Rickard Petersson, R&D Director, Ansys
https://blog.samtec.com/post/practical-ports-for-perfect-performance-p
retend-or-possible/
On Thu, May 27, 2021, 10:03 PM Nikita Ambasana
<ambasananikita@xxxxxxxxx>
wrote:
Hello,a
Is there a relation between the physical length being de-embedded
out of
structure (microstrip - DUT - microstrip) and accuracy ofthe
de-embedding in the 2-20GHz range for HFSS? Is there some limitation
on the electrical length on either side of the DUT that cannot be
accurately de-embedded for this frequency range and could cause
spurious spikes in
S-parameters?
Thanks,
Nikita
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