Thank you. This is helpful. Are you saying that the two behaviors (GO and move on a loose lead) are mutually exclusive? Here is where I am having a problem, as I try to learn to tell good fronts from faulty fronts: When there is tension on the lead, (i.e. the dog and handler are pulling on the lead from opposing ends), many dogs appear (at least to me) to lift whether or not this is a structurally determined behavior. The same dog, on a loose lead, may display proper movement. Can anyone help me further with this? I am not trying to be argumentative. I don't know enough to argue! LOL!!! Dr. Zoa Rockenstein RiverRock ________________________________ From: Rbuffdogs@xxxxxxx [mailto:Rbuffdogs@xxxxxxx] Sent: Thu 12/7/2006 11:51 AM To: Rockenstein, Zoa L. ; rivendellp@xxxxxxxxxxxxx; michel.chaloux@xxxxxxxxxxxx; showgsd-l@xxxxxxxxxxxxx Subject: Re: [ SHOWGSD-L ] Re: Loose & Easy In a message dated 12/7/2006 9:43:00 A.M. Pacific Standard Time, zlrockenstein@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx writes: Please tell me more about why they could not be trained to gait properly on a loose lead when required to. In my experience, they do what we teach them to do. And they can certainly be a handful if allowed to do anything their way! Specialty dogs are taught one thing from puppyhood, and that is to GO! We encourage it, we covet it, it is the GO and drive that carries them through a long career. They are conditioned and trained to go and keep going...we have dogs here that will GO until you or they drop, if you would ask....to keep that spark we allow this, and it can be toned down after a suitable warm up period . Sometimes as is the case with Ch. Nitro some of his kids or Callie ...that warm up period may be 2-3 miles of gaiting BEFORE class time. These dogs get out and move because they LOVE it, and we never ever dissuade that in them. It is worth it, because after a looonnnng class, in the heat , with walking and gaiting, they are fresh and still ready to GO...they don't come apart, only the handlers and doublers are exhausted at class end. I prefer the GO ethic in the dogs to the "pitty pat" around the ring politely. These are working dogs , and should have the ability to work all day, at all speeds. Kathy Tank Victory German Shepherds <http://www.victorygermanshepherds.com/index.htm> ~ WEBSITE UPDATED: Nov 13, 2006 Home of CH. ELVASTON'S NATIONS CUP, TC, OFA H/E DNA'D "NITRO" 26 BISS/ BESTS OF BREED TO DATE 2006 PACIFIC COAST VICTOR ============================================================================ POST is Copyrighted 2006. All material remains the property of the original author and of GSD Communication, Inc. NO REPRODUCTIONS or FORWARDS of any kind are permitted without prior permission of the original author AND of the Showgsd-l Management. ALL RIGHTS RESERVED. ALL PERSONS ARE ON NOTICE THAT THE FORWARDING, REPRODUCTION OR USE IN ANY MANNER OF ANY MATERIAL WHICH APPEARS ON SHOWGSD-L WITHOUT THE EXPRESS PERMISSION OF ALL PARTIES TO THE POST AND THE LIST MANAGEMENT IS EXPRESSLY FORBIDDEN, AND IS A VIOLATION OF LAW. VIOLATORS OF THIS PROHIBITION WILL BE PROSECUTED. For assistance, please contact the List Management at admin@xxxxxxxxxxxx VISIT OUR WEBSITE - URL temporarily deleted due to AOL issues ============================================================================