Yes you are right, I don't want to say that Firefox is bad. I'd prefer it to IE if there would be a better screen reader than Jaws. But Jaws is the best, and if it doesn't work well with some other programs, then it doesn't matter why. The fact is that the blind are disadvantaged because of many commercial interests.
Octavian----- Original Message ----- From: "Aaron Leventhal" <aaronlev@xxxxxxxxxxx>
To: <programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> Sent: Wednesday, October 24, 2007 7:59 PM Subject: Re: accessible ajax
Firefox might not be as perfect as IE from within JAWS, but that's not because of Firefox. We expose everything JAWS needs, so it's not quite fair to say make a blanket statement that Firefox is less accessible than IE. Firefox has a number of accessibility features that IE does not.You might have just meant IE works a bit better with JAWS than Firefox. I realize most users have JAWS but let's make sure we're clear about where the problems actually are :)ARIA is accessible, and does work with JAWS. For example, you can use the Dojo tree view with Firefox 2 and JAWS 8 (might work in earlier versions, but I just verified this works with my own test):http://archive.dojotoolkit.org/nightly/dojotoolkit/dijit/tests/test_Tree.htmlI notice that it repeats the word "open" and "closed" unnecessarily, but I believe that is an issue in Dojo's ARIA implemention for tree view, not in Firefox or JAWS.There are examples of other widgets in the same directory. We're still fixing bugs, but the bottom line is it basically works with Firefox 2 and JAWS 8+- Aaron Octavian Rasnita wrote:What do you want to demonstrate?You already said in a previous email that ARIA is not accessible and I know that Firefox is not as accessible as IE, but you recommend me to search more information about them?If Firefox instanciate them as common html controls is not important for the moment, because most of the blind use IE which doesn't do that, and that thing is not a standard anyway, not to mention that they are not very accessible for us.Octavian ----- Original Message ----- From: "Sina Bahram" <sbahram@xxxxxxxxx> To: <programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> Sent: Wednesday, October 24, 2007 6:51 PM Subject: RE: accessible ajaxThen I'd suggest you to more research into ARIA and frameworks like dojo andopenlaszlo Also firefox instanciates these things as actual controls, so this is a rather uninformed opinion that it's just javascript and dhtml. Take care, Sina -----Original Message----- From: programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx[mailto:programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Octavian RasnitaSent: Wednesday, October 24, 2007 11:12 AM To: programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx Subject: Re: accessible ajaxI know what AJAX is, and I already used AJAX, but I can also tell that thereare no AJAX controls. This is just a nice word but only that. Those so called controls are nothing more than simple Javascript code,generated manually or by a Javascript library that draw menus, tree views, WYSIWYG editors or other things. The result is a dynamicly generated HTML control or a dynamicly generated html link or simple text. I haven't seenanything else than that. Octavian ----- Original Message ----- From: "Sina Bahram" <sbahram@xxxxxxxxx> To: <programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> Sent: Wednesday, October 24, 2007 3:29 PM Subject: RE: accessible ajaxhttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ajax_(programming) Take care, Sina -----Original Message----- From: programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Octavian Rasnita Sent: Wednesday, October 24, 2007 8:18 AM To: programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx Subject: Re: accessible ajax What is an Ajax control? Can you give some examples? Octavian ----- Original Message ----- From: "Richard Thomas" <rthomas@xxxxxxxxxxx> To: <programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> Sent: Wednesday, October 24, 2007 2:49 PM Subject: Re: accessible ajaxHi Guys:I work in the Visual Studio, actually Express, environment. I read aboutAjax Accessibility issues but thought they were due to the nature of dynamic html rendered at run-time and Screen Readers.If you use Ajax controls, let me know how they rendered and worked withyour Screen Reader as I was thinking of going that route myself.It sounds like this is a Development environment but if it addresses any run-time problems let me know also and I'll dig into it and may switch toAjax or whatever MS is calling it these days. Thanks: Rick Farmington Mich. USA ----- Original Message ----- From: "Sina Bahram" <sbahram@xxxxxxxxx> To: <programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> Sent: Tuesday, October 23, 2007 11:40 PM Subject: RE: accessible ajaxI'm always glad to hear about and see someone else using this. Take care, Sina -----Original Message----- From: programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of jaffar Sent: Tuesday, October 23, 2007 10:59 PM To: programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx Subject: accessible ajax Hi All. I have found an accessible, free and open source ajax developmentframework known as Open Lazlo. It consists of a web based development framework and a tomcat server which is directed to port 8080 on your pc. Although this is strictly an ajax framework, it is based on the LZX, xml based language which provides for very tight xml syntax. The website to download this app is, should you be interested, www.openlaszlo.org/ Itisalso worth noting that you will be able to create desktop apps with this framework. The only other dependency you will need to run Open Lazlo isthe java development kit consisting of the JRE and the sdk which you can obtainfrom the java website. The framework itself is very easy to master, andthe accompanying documentation is very good and comprehensive. 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