[lit-ideas] Re: Very Highly Griceian
- From: Donal McEvoy <donalmcevoyuk@xxxxxxxxxxx>
- To: "lit-ideas@xxxxxxxxxxxxx" <lit-ideas@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
- Date: Sun, 23 Nov 2014 12:22:02 +0000 (UTC)
>Grice (WoW -- Way of Words): "Even if my assumption of what goes for me
goes for others is mistaken, it does not matter;>
But it does matter. Very much so. It goes to the heart of the value of this
kind of philosophising. And what Grice goes on to say after the quoted words
shows this - for it shows that insofar as the assumption that 'what goes for me
goes for others' is mistaken so what goes for me is not a correct basis for
preaching to others. Grice's philosophy becomes a preaching to the converted or
those who share his claims as to sense.
Btw, JLS refusal to admit he mistakenly attributed to me a view I never
expressed, and which is a silly view, is itself silly; and the idea he can
defend his view by snipping words out of context is also silly; and the idea he
can continue to defend himself by repeatedly snipping words out of context is
also silly - even highly silly. But not the first time we have seen this.
Facing up to one's mistakes requires more than some kinds of education provide.
Dnl
On Sunday, 23 November 2014, 6:18, Adriano Palma <Palma@xxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
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div.yiv1958155576WordSection1 {}#yiv1958155576 Yes, it is of value to him, so
why bust my balls with this junk? -----Original Message-----
From: lit-ideas-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:lit-ideas-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On
Behalf Of dmarc-noreply@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Sent: 22 November 2014 23:29
To: lit-ideas@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: [lit-ideas] Re: Very Highly Griceian In a message dated 11/22/2014
3:32:38 A.M. Eastern Standard Time,donalmcevoyuk@xxxxxxxxxxx writes: "The
reality is that there is a vast swathe of English speakers outside of Oxbridge
who would not bat an eye nor have a problem understanding sentences
[containing 'highly wicked' and 'highly depressed'] Just to clarify a few
points. >speakers outside Oxbridge. I'm not so sure I want Cambridge
included. One good thing of Grice's Oxonian type of ordinary language
philosophy is that it could never have a counterpart on the other stone-wall
varsity on the Cam. But even within Oxford, surely the formulation of the
thesis by Grice and by Warnock differ. I happen to prefer Grice's formulation.
He refers to: "an effort to explain why sometimes the word 'very' allows,
with little or no change of meaning the substitution of the word 'highly'
(as in 'very unusual') and sometimes does not (as in 'very depressed' or
'very wicked'). Warnock's formulation is in terms of a question: "Why can
one be highly intelligent or highly interesting, but not highly stupid or
highly dull?" Note that in Grice's formulation there is a reference to 'a
change of meaning'. This can be 'small' or not small, i.e. what I propose to
call 'huge'. In Warnock's formulation, there is a reference to a _modality_:
what one can and what one cannot. Warnock's formulation is stronger. Back to
Grice: "an effort to explain why sometimes the word 'very' allows, with
little or no change of meaning the substitution of the word 'highly' (as in
'very unusual') and sometimes does not (as in 'very depressed' or 'very
wicked'). Commentary: Grice gives this as a fact. So the effort is to
explain the fact. Not to question the fact. The fact is that i. Sometimes (as
in the case of 'unusual'), there is a little change of meaning (utterer's
meaning or implicature, surely) between the following: ------------------
That's very unusual of her. ------------------ That's highly unusual of her.
There is no need to introduce E(+) and E(-) at this point, since 'unusual' is
neutral (cfr. 'highly sacrilegious' vs. 'lowly sacrilegious'). The second
part of Grice's thesis is the negation of (i). ii. Sometimes (as in the case
of 'depressed' and 'wicked') there is a HUGE change of meaning (or implicature)
between ----------------- He is very depressed. ----------------- He is highly
depressed and ----------------- That's very wicked. ----------------- That's
highly wicked. So to go back to McEvoy:: "there is a vast swathe of English
speakers outside of Oxbridge who would not bat an eye nor have a problem
understanding sentences [containing 'highly wicked' and 'highly depressed']"
Grice would possibly say that as long as Grice does bat an eye (usually the
left) there's room for a highly peculiar form of Oxonian analysis. Grice
(WoW -- Way of Words): "Even if my assumption of what goes for me goes for
others is mistaken, it does not matter; my philosophical puzzles have arisen
in connection with my use of an expression and my conceptual analysis will be
of value TO ME, and to any others who may find that their use of the expression
coincides with mine. It may also be of value to those whose use of the
expresssion is *different*, though different only in minor respects, from
mine; but if this is not so, then we have a different use of the expression,
to be dealt with separately, to be subjected to separate conceptual analysis.
This we can do if the need arises (since cooperation in conceptual analysis
does not demand identity as regards the uses of the analyzed expressions; I
can, with you, attempt the conceptual analysis of your use of an expression,
even if your use is different from mine)." Cheers, Speranza
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