[lit-ideas] Re: On Studying History
- From: "Lawrence Helm" <lawrencehelm@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
- To: <lit-ideas@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
- Date: Sat, 16 Sep 2006 16:33:37 -0700
Judy,
Do you ever discuss main arguments? If you read the books I am discussing
you wouldn't be interesting in quibbling about their authors abilities to
write history. Of course I disagree with what they've written, but their
works are works of history. This is like quibbling about whether someone
who writes from a Marxist perspective, subscribes to Marxist philosophy or
believes in Marxist ideology is a Marxist.
Read Orientalism. It is the historical work I'm talking about. It was
written by Edward Said. It is a work of history. Everyone who reads it
knows that. Pardon me if I call the writer of one of the most influential
works of history in the 20th century an historian. People who list the
attributes of Edward Said will include "historian." See for example
http://www.palgrave-usa.com/catalog/product.aspx?isbn=1905422040
Read The Islamic Threat, Myth or Reality. It was written by John Esposito.
It is a work of history. Everyone who reads it knows that. Pardon me if I
call the writer of one of the most influential works on Islam in English
prior to 9/11 an historian.
<http://www.palgrave-usa.com/catalog/product.aspx?isbn=1905422040>
http://www.palgrave-usa.com/catalog/product.aspx?isbn=1905422040 which
includes the description of Esposito who "Offers a valuable history of the
leading figures and movements in the 20th century Islamic revival,
underlining the trend in recent years away from violence and toward
parliamentary practices."--The New York Times. Not so many people are
willing to say that after 9/11 however.
I am just finishing James Bowman's Honor, a History. I shall very likely
refer to Bowman in the future as an historian. He did his research and
wrote a very powerful work of history.
Must rush off and feed my dogs. No more time to research these well known
facts; which incidentally don't pertain to my main discussion, but then such
quibbles rarely do, do they?
Lawrence
-----Original Message-----
From: lit-ideas-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:lit-ideas-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx]
On Behalf Of Judith Evans
Sent: Saturday, September 16, 2006 1:06 PM
To: lit-ideas@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: [lit-ideas] Re: On Studying History
LH> You can't dismiss Edward Said because he is critical.
I said he was neither an historian nor a Marxist.
LH>And you are wrong to say that John Esposito is not an
historian.
I can find no reference to his studying history. (I agree he has
edited historical works). He is not (unless I have missed
something
relating to this) a Marxist.
LH>The term used to encompass history, sociology, economy,
LH>etc in America is "Area Studies"
1. we use Area Studies here too, to mean -- as in the US -- the
inter- or multi-disciplinary *study of an area*.
2. Neither here nor in the US are historians (etc.) who focus on
an *area* necessarily members of an Area Studies Department or
Centre. (Examples on request.)
3. John Esposito (who studied
theology as an undergraduate) is Professor of Religion and
International Affairs at Georgetown. He's also head of its
Centre for Muslim-Christian Understanding. He seems to
be a director of its School of Foreign Service there.
LH>I use the term "historian" but Universities and the
LH> government use the term "studies" or "area studies."
(I already said this but) THIS IS NOT TRUE. See here
http://www.historians.org/
http://www.yale.edu/history/
http://www.fas.harvard.edu/~history/
(etc. etc. etc. etc.)
LH>I have no wish to go into the development of historical,
LH>sociological, economical studies in American universities
LH>each time I discuss the influence of Marxist-oriented
LH>historians on American "Middle-Eastern Studies."
Given that the Marxist-oriented historians you name aren't
Marxists or
historians (actually I may be being unfair about Esposito, it may
be he
could be considered an historian) and that you seem to know
little
about anything in US universities, that may be just as well.
LH>It seems to be easier to get Title VI money if you use the
word studies.
Now you're getting somewhere: *Area* Studies does sometimes
attract more money.
LH>Thus, Esposito graduated in Islamic studies at Temple
University in 1974.
His doctorate's from Temple. His first degree's in Theology. (I
read.)
(Whatever.)
LH>And I have mentioned another Marxist who strongly
LH>influenced the attitude of the Muslims in the Middle
LH>East who were becoming Militant, Franz Fanon
I think you must mean *a* Marxist. Franz Fanon (1925-
1961) was a doctor (a psychiatrist). Still, eventually you found
a Marxist. (NB, not a Leninist.)
I didn't know Fanon was an influence on present-day militant
Islamists, he was certainly an influence on Steve Biko and
Che Guevara (oh, he seems to have influenced the Palestinians,
the Tamils, and the Irish -- and of course, the
African-Americans,
I'd expect that).
Judy Evans, Cardiff
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