[openbeos] Re: Themes
- From: "Chris Peel" <chris@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
- To: <openbeos@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
- Date: Thu, 7 Sep 2006 16:29:13 +0100
Hi Michael
Your final comment was really all I was expecting! :) It just caught me out
(and p---d me off to be honest) when I got those two initial responses. No
matter though, I appreciate people are working hard and get frustrated when
someone comes along with a request/demand/order, etc. Surprising as it may
seem, I'm not a 16-20 year old who chucks his toys out of the pram when he
doesn't get his own way; I was simply trying to express a view I've
developed over the last five years of app development under Windows - all of
my apps have been very eye-candy/ui related (dotWidget, Snarl, Cloud:9ine)
so although I'm no expert in the area I do have a certain vested interest in
this area. I don't develop for them but I've also got a Mac Mini running
OSX, a small PC running R5 and Haiku, and an Amiga 4000 - and I still
appreciate the benefits of all the different operating systems.
And to clarify - the only 'themeing' part of the o/s I was asking about was
the icons. I'm perfectly happy with the yellow tabs and grey borders -
hard-coded or not! :)
-----Original Message-----
From: openbeos-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:openbeos-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx]
On Behalf Of Michael Phipps
Sent: 07 September 2006 13:56
To: openbeos@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: [openbeos] Themes
Chris Peel wrote:
> I didn't intend to cause a fight and I don't appreciate the fairly
> rude "it's our way or no way" responses received as I don't think
> that's the Be (or hopefully) Haiku way.
I didn't see them as rude, but I am sorry that you feel that way.
> Lars is right - Windows does allow theming and you could change your
> icons (via TweakUI - a Microsoft product) since Windows 98.
There are a lot of things included in the term "themes". I am not sure
which exactly you mean.
- Changing the icon set
- Changing the colors of windows, buttons, etc
- Changing the shapes and designs of windows
- Changing the default graphics (close button, resize, sliders)
BeOS R5 included some of these fully (icons), some partly (sliders) and
some not at all (colors and shapes of windows).
> Windows XP includes theming because Micrsoft - finally - caught up
> with the fact that users want theming support in their operating
> system. For goodness sake, even Dano shipped with a moderate form of
> theming support, although it was in its infancy.
If you are talking about "Windows and buttons", Windows includes two - XP
and classic (Fisher price and boring business). :-D I couldn't quickly find
anywhere or any way to add more. Nor does Vista add any. I am not saying
that we should limit ourselves to what the Redmondians do, but to say that
MS caught the idea that people want to theme the OS is, I think,
overstating it a little. MS introduced a new look that everyone either
loves or hates. They figured this out and made it switchable.
> I'm really surprised at the response this post has got. I wasn't
> demanding theming support (I apologise if it was interpreted in such a
> way) and I don't expect the devs to stop what they're doing and
> include it. I just hope Axel's and Stefano's responses are not
> indicative of the Haiku project overall.
We have had this conversation many times. It should be in the FAQs (Jorge,
if you would?). Personally, I don't think that theming has a lot of value
or is of importance. I think that there is a lot of value in one look. App
developers can create icons and colors of their own and know that
everything will look good on every system. If you look at some of the
systems that do allow changes, if you make those changes, apps look really
bad - unprofessional and ugly. If we want to add the ability to change
things like the default grey and yellow colors, I think that we need to
find a way to make that work well. It isn't trivial. Not to mention the
number of apps out there that have the yellow and/or grey RGB colors hard
coded. I *KNOW* that, in those cases, it is the apps fault. But, as an
alternative OS platform, there aren't 50 of any app to choose from. :-)
> I'm sorry if this sounds like I'm up my own a**e or conceited or
> anything but if you want Haiku to be an o/s of the future you need to
> forget about 1999 and get with the times. I want (sorry, would like)
> to be able to sync. my mobile phone via bluetooth with Haiku, run it
> on a laptop and connect via wireless, etc. I appreciate this may not
> be the goal of R1 but to simply dismiss it with a "well I don't do it
> so I can't imagine anyone else would want to" repsonse is very
> disappointing.
I want to sync my phone, too. :-) I don't see themes as a make or break
issue. Very, very far from it. In fact, I would bet that less than 1 in a
1000 people would turn from Haiku if it didn't have that. Drivers and apps
are far more critical. :D I guess the official party line is "We will look
into it when it gets to the top of the priority list."
Michael
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