[wisb] Re: barred owls VS spotted owls
- From: "Kevin" <dkkearns@xxxxxxxxxx>
- To: "'[Wisb]'" <wisbirdn@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
- Date: Sat, 12 Dec 2009 06:45:27 -0600
I understand the basics of splitting and can see the appeal that we humans
have in categorizing everything natural and unnatural, but can see no real
reason to split the Spotted Owls into different species. I doubt if anyone
has tried, but one of the most basic criteria for a species is the ability
to produce viable offspring. This of course assumes that you follow the
biological species concept and not the morphological or Phylogenetic species
concepts! So while it might appear that the two populations of Owls are
separated geographically, is there any evidence that they are unable to
interbreed or that their genomes are that distinct from each other?
But then we already have several birds that have been split but have been
shown to freely interbreed once these geographic barriers are disturbed or
torn down. Just look at the number of hybrid flycatchers, orioles, ducks,
and of course Gulls that we see. All of these "species" appear to freely
interbreed and produce viable offspring, thereby casting doubt on their
classifications and the idea of what defines a species. I personally do not
think that geographic separation should be used as an overwhelming criteria.
For example, look at Tits from around the world. The Blue Tit is obviously
isolated from a Chickadee in North America. But when you put them together,
they will produce viable offspring. So while they obviously differ
morphologically, genetically they are not different enough to inhibit
offspring production. I am not saying that they are not different species at
all, just that the whole concept is fuzzy and muddled and riddled with
questions that do not neatly fit into one of the shoeboxes that we try to
store everything away in.
Of course, I doubt if the owls give a hoot what they are called as long as
they have habitat in which to survive, which in the case of the
Pacific/Northern Spotted owl is of utmost importance.
Kevin Kearns
Neenah
-----Original Message-----
From: wisbirdn-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
[mailto:wisbirdn-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx]On Behalf Of Chris West
Sent: Thursday, December 10, 2009 4:02 PM
To: Joey Reichhoff; jbahls@xxxxxxxxxxxx
Cc: [Wisb]
Subject: [wisb] Re: barred owls VS spotted owls
Actually, rather than lumping, it is more the belief that Spotted Owl should
be split into at least 2 separate species.
"Pacific" Spotted Owl and "Mexican" Spotted Owl. If you check a range map,
the two populations are geographically separated and, on most audio CDs, the
two subspecies are recorded separately. The two subspecies live in
different habitats, have different breeding and foraging behaviors and don't
even sound the same. To top it off, from both living in AZ all summer and
talking to people there, I would have a hard time believing that "Mexican"
Spotted Owl is even endangered. It doesn't appear to have anywhere near the
difficulties that "Pacific" Spotted Owl does.
So with that, IMHO, "Mexican" and "Pacific" Spotted Owls should be split to
separate species. Note that I haven't done the legwork or research needed to
split these two, it's just my opinion on the subject.
I almost wonder whether the same could be applied to Northern and Southern
populations of Barred Owl? The two populations are not geographically
separated, and I know far less about the eastern BAOW population but it is
something interesting to think about.
Happy Birding! --Chris W, Richland County
http://swallowtailedkite.blogspot.com/
http://www.flickr.com/photos/swallowtailphoto
"The beauty and genius of a work of art may be reconceived, though its first
material expression be destroyed; a vanished harmony may yet again inspire
the composer; but when the last individual of a race of living things
breathes no more, another heaven and another earth must pass before such a
one can be again."
(From William Beebe's "The Bird: Its Form and Function," 1906)
> Date: Thu, 10 Dec 2009 15:40:37 -0600
> Subject: [wisb] Re: barred owls VS spotted owls
> From: jreichhoff@xxxxxxxxx
> To: jbahls@xxxxxxxxxxxx
> CC: wisbirdn@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>
> Maybe if we just combined the two species as one, the Sparred Owl, we
> wouldn't have this problem.
>
> Joey Reichhoff
> Fond du Lac
>
> On 12/10/09, Jeffrey Bahls <jbahls@xxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>> controversial plan
>>
http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories/U/US_OWL_VS_OWL?SITE=WIMIL&SECTION=HOME
&TEMPLATEÞFAULT
>> Jeff Bahls
>> Lowell Wi
>> Dodge county
>>
>>
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