[THIN] Re: OT now how much will it cost
- From: "Steve Greenberg" <steveg@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
- To: <thin@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
- Date: Wed, 21 Apr 2004 08:45:09 -0700
If a software provider could come out with a comprehensive suite for
performance, security and printing in Terminal Services for $500 they =
would
sell many copies and it could become ubiquitous.
The challenge is that they have to recoup development costs, pay support
personnel and spend a fortune selling and marketing the products.
"I want a golden toilet baby, but it's just not in the cards!" (Austin
Powers)
Steve Greenberg
Thin Client Computing
34522 N. Scottsdale Rd. suite D8453
Scottsdale, AZ 85262
(602) 432-8649
(602) 296-0411 fax=20
steveg@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx
-----Original Message-----
From: thin-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:thin-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On =
Behalf
Of Shonk, Joe - Perot
Sent: Wednesday, April 21, 2004 8:21 AM
To: 'thin@xxxxxxxxxxxxx'
Subject: [THIN] Re: OT now how much will it cost
Yup, and to reroof your house shouldn't cost more that the house did. =
(ie..
the Appsense suite goes for $3400, I can buy a server plus the OS for
that)
Joe
-----Original Message-----
From: Jeff Stockard [mailto:jstockard@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx]
Sent: Wednesday, April 21, 2004 7:05 AM
To: thin@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: [THIN] OT now how much will it cost
For the same reason that, if you have a faster car, gas will cost twice =
as
much. Wait a minute, they don't do that. Maybe it only costs more if =
your
car can hold more people. Wait, they don't do that either. Maybe it's =
like,
if you have a lot of land, the builder will charge you more to work on =
your
house. No, they don't do that. I don't understand why after all. It is
probably my limited knowledge. Jeff
-----Original Message-----
From: thin-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:thin-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On =
Behalf
Of Claudio Rodrigues
Sent: Wednesday, April 21, 2004 9:58 AM
To: thin@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: [THIN] Re: SV: Re: OT: SQL 2000 on Win2K3 Server, /PAE /3GB =
again
I know that. The whole point is that as a developer of TS related apps, =
I
just do not get why charge people twice the price just because
hyperthreading is there, on TS related software. The same about the =
magic
US$ 1000 number that I have heard a couple times from people on the TS
arena. Well I guess I need to shut my mouth. :-)
-----Original Message-----
From: thin-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:thin-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On =
Behalf
Of Bernd Harzog
Sent: April 21, 2004 9:29 AM
To: thin@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: [THIN] Re: SV: Re: OT: SQL 2000 on Win2K3 Server, /PAE /3GB =
again
Just so everyone knows how this works. There is an OS API call that you
=3D3D3D can make to have the OS tell you how many CPU's there are in the =
box.
In =3D3D3D Windows 2000 a dual with hyperthreading is reported as a quad =
by
the OS. =3D3D3D In Windows 2003 it is reported correctly as two physical =
and
two =3D3D3D additional "logical" processors.
As a software vendor, if you want to do something about this, you have =
=3D =3D3D
=3D3D3D to write code to the actual hardware to determine the real =
number of =3D
=3D3D3D CPU's when running on Windows 2000. We have done this so our =
licensing
=3D =3D3D =3D3D3D is able to correctly (in our opinion) charge you only =
for a dual
no =3D =3D3D3D matter if it is dual with or without hyperthreading, and =
no
matter what =3D3D3D OS you are running on.
As a further point of interest, the physical CPU's are numbers 0 and 1,
=3D3D3D and the logical CPU's are numbers 2 and 3. The behavior of the =
logical
=3D =3D3D =3D3D3D CPU's is different from that of the physical CPU's. =
For example
if you =3D =3D3D =3D3D3D force a process to run on only one of the =
logical CPU's,
it slows down =3D =3D3D =3D3D3D the whole server dramatically.
Cheers,
Bernd Harzog
CEO
RTO Software, Inc.
bernd.harzog@xxxxxxxxxxx
678-455-5506 x701
www.rtosoft.com
-----Original Message-----
From: Claudio Rodrigues =3D
[mailto:crodrigues@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx]=3D3D3D20
Sent: Wednesday, April 21, 2004 8:54 AM
To: thin@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: [THIN] Re: SV: Re: OT: SQL 2000 on Win2K3 Server, /PAE
/3GB =3D3D3D
again
Tricerat makes you pay for every single CPU instance the OS finds. :-( =
That
is bad.
-----Original Message-----
From: thin-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:thin-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On =
Behalf
Of Evan Mann
Sent: April 21, 2004 8:50 AM
To: thin@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: [THIN] Re: SV: Re: OT: SQL 2000 on Win2K3 Server, /PAE /3GB =
again
I'm glad Microsoft doesn't try to get you for 2 processors licenses for
every single HT enabled processor you have. 2 dual Xeon boxes is bad =
enough
to licenses, but if you had to pay for 8 CPUs total, ouch! =3D3D3D3D3D20
-----Original Message-----
From: thin-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:thin-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On =
Behalf
Of Svein Arild Haugum
Sent: Wednesday, April 21, 2004 5:39 AM
To: thin@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: [THIN] SV: Re: OT: SQL 2000 on Win2K3 Server, /PAE /3GB again
Yes, its true, you need SQL Enterprise edition to use more than 2GB for
=3D3D3D3D3D3D SQL. And that cost like hell.
Mvh
Svein Arild
-----Opprinnelig melding-----
Fra: Brian Madden [mailto:brian@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx]
Sendt: 20. april 2004 20:22
Til: thin@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Emne: [THIN] Re: OT: SQL 2000 on Win2K3 Server, /PAE /3GB again
I don't agree with the statement that SQL will cap at 2GB on a 4GB box.
Using the /3GB switch will allow the SQL service to address 3GB of RAM
instead of 2GB.
I do believe you need to be using the Enterprise Edition of SQL for it =
to
access more than 2GB of RAM, though.
Brian
Brian Madden
brian@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
+1.202.302.3657
Visit www.brianmadden.com for in-depth Citrix, Terminal Server, and
server-based computing news and analysis, white papers, downloadable =
videos,
and product reviews.
-----Original Message-----
From: thin-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:thin-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On =
Behalf
Of Henry Sieff
Sent: Tuesday, April 20, 2004 11:57 AM
To: 'thin@xxxxxxxxxxxxx'
Subject: [THIN] Re: OT: SQL 2000 on Win2K3 Server, /PAE /3GB again
It'll 'use' it, but it won't use it for SQL or exchange - that'll cap at =
2
GB on a 4 GB box. I do the same thing; pretty much the only servers I =
don't
do that with are Citrix and file/print. Also played around with AWE on =
SQL,
but it actually didn't work out for me (this was early on in SQL2K, =
though,
so maybe I will revisit the issue).
Henry
> -----Original Message-----
> From: thin-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:thin-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx]On
> Behalf Of Evan Mann
> Sent: Tuesday, April 20, 2004 11:53 AM
> To: thin@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> Subject: [THIN] Re: OT: SQL 2000 on Win2K3 Server, /PAE /3GB =3D3D3D3D
again=3D3D3D3D3D20
>=3D3D3D3D3D3D3D20 =3D3D3D3D3D3D3D20 I opted for /3GB on my SQL Boxes =
and =3D
=3D3D
Exchange
=3D3D3D
=3D3D3D3D
Boxes =3D3D3D3D3D
(both=3D3D3D3D3D20
>4GB=3D3D3D3D3D3D3D20 of RAM and dedicated to their respective apps). =
I
wasn't=3D3D3D3D3D20
>sure if the system actually used the 4GB w/o the /3GB switch, but
the=3D3D3D3D3D20
>3 GB to=3D3D3D3D3D3D3D20 user mode is definitely what I want.=20
>=3D3D3D3D3D3D3D20 Thanks,
>=3D3D3D3D3D3D3D20
> Evan=3D3D3D3D3D3D3D3D20
>=3D3D3D3D3D3D3D20
> -----Original Message-----
> From: thin-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:thin-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On
>Behalf Of Brian Madden
> Sent: Tuesday, April 20, 2004 12:45 PM
> To: thin@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> Subject: [THIN] Re: OT: SQL 2000 on Win2K3 Server, /PAE /3GB =3D3D3D3D
again=3D3D3D3D3D20
>=3D3D3D3D3D3D3D20 You do not need PAE.
>=3D3D3D3D3D3D3D20
> By default, the 4GB of RAM is split 50/50 between the kernel and your
>applications (i.e. SQL). You would probably be well served =3D3D3D
to=3D3D3D3D3D3D3D20 =3D3D3D3D
=3D3D3D3D3D
use
>/3GB, because that will give you 3GB for the apps (SQL) and =
=3D3D3D3D3D
leave=3D3D3D3D3D3D3D20
>only 1GB for the kernel. If this is a dedicated SQL server, 1GB should
>be=3D3D3D3D3D3D3D20 plenty for the SQL server.
>=3D3D3D3D3D3D3D20
> (If this is also, for example, a busy file server or DC, I probably
=3D3D3D3D3D20
>wouldn't mess with /3GB and leave the memory split 50/50.=20
>=3D3D3D3D3D3D3D20 Brian
>=3D3D3D3D3D3D3D20
> Brian Madden
> brian@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> +1.202.302.3657
> Visit www.brianmadden.com for in-depth Citrix, Terminal Server, and
=3D3D3D3D3D20
>server-based computing news and analysis, white papers, downloadable
=3D3D3D3D3D20
>videos, and product reviews.
>=3D3D3D3D3D3D3D20
> -----Original Message-----
> From: thin-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:thin-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On
>Behalf Of Henry Sieff
> Sent: Tuesday, April 20, 2004 10:48 AM
> To: 'thin@xxxxxxxxxxxxx'
> Subject: [THIN] Re: OT: SQL 2000 on Win2K3 Server, /PAE /3GB =3D3D3D3D
again=3D3D3D3D3D20
>=3D3D3D3D3D3D3D20 The 3GB switch operates as before. Not sure about =
the=20
>=3D
=3D3D
=3D3D3D
=3D3D3D3D3D
PAE.=3D3D3D3D3D3D3D20
>You also have more flexibility ib the memory tuning. =3D3D3D3D3D3D3D20
> =3D3D3D
http://support.microsoft.com/default.aspx?scid=3D3D3D3D3D3D3D3D3D3Dkb;en-=
us=3D
;
3=3D3D
1
> 6739&Produc=3D3D3D3D3D3D3D3D
> t
> =3D3D3D3D3D3D3D3D3D3D=3D3D3D3D3D3D3D3D3D
> w
> insv
> r2003
>=3D3D3D3D3D3D3D20
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: thin-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:thin-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx]On
> > Behalf Of Evan Mann
> > Sent: Tuesday, April 20, 2004 10:41 AM
> > To: thin@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> > Subject: [THIN] OT: SQL 2000 on Win2K3 Server, /PAE =3D3D
/3GB=3D3D3D3D3D3D3D20
> again =3D3D3D3D3D3D3D3D3D20 =3D3D3D3D3D3D3D3D
> =3D3D3D3D3D3D3D3D3D20
>=3D3D3D3D3D3D3D20
> >I have SQL 2000 SP3a Enterprise on Windows 2003 =3D3D
Enterprise=3D3D3D3D3D3D3D20
> server with
>=3D3D3D3D3D3D3D20
> >4GB of ram.
> > Do I need either the /3GB or the /PAE switch to use the 4GB of RAM?=20
> >=3D3D3D3D3D3D3D3D3D20 =3D3D3D3D3D3D3D3D3D20
> >=3D3D3D3D3D3D3D3D3D20
> > ********************************************************
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and=3D3D3D3D3D3D3D3D20=3D3D3D3D3D20
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