Joe, I wish we could solve all of the problems created by "bad" and "sloppy" programming practices in the Microsoft applications enviroment. As much as I appreciate your assumption that we can, the fundamental facts are: 1) Microsoft is in a race with the Java folks to make developers more productive, and to allow them to get their applications into production more quickly than would be possible if you built them in a non-Microsoft way. 2) Developers (no matter what platform or middleware they are writing to) are under unrelenting pressure from their business staff to get the next feature set into the software. 1 and 2 above combine to create a situation where software is written with the objective of getting the desired functionality into the hands of the user as fast as possible, because this is what pays the bills for either the business folks in the IS shop or the product managers at the software vendors. The net result of this is that operational efficiency and reliabilty take a second seat to the addition of features. We at RTO exist for the sole purpose of allowing you to have your cake and eat it to - which means that developers can add features quickly and RTO takes care of making it run well in your environment. So, the bottom line is that you can count on us to do what we can to push the balance of the scales back towards a compromise between functionality and performance/stability. It is unrealistic to expect us to solve all of the problems that the pressure to have a fast time to market create. Best Regards, Bernd Harzog CEO RTO Software bernd@xxxxxxxxxxxx -----Original Message----- From: Shonk, Joe - Perot [mailto:JShonk@xxxxxxx] Sent: Fri 2/13/2004 5:40 PM To: 'thin@xxxxxxxxxxxxx' Cc: Subject: [THIN] Re: OT: OT: What's the biggest problem you deal with? Not Microsoft's fault? I tend to disagree. Asside from a whole discussion on Microsoft's inability to reclaim those resources. After all, that is what TScale does. So it is possible. Anyway, reboots are Microsoft's fault... Take a look at MS Bulletin 04-007, it is marked as critical and it requires a reboot. For a small 8/5 shop, rebooting a server is not a big deal. For a 24/7 Enterprise, it's not quite that simple. Joe -----Original Message----- From: Bernd Harzog [mailto:Bernd.Harzog@xxxxxxxxxxx] Sent: Friday, February 13, 2004 2:52 PM To: thin@xxxxxxxxxxxxx Subject: [THIN] Re: OT: OT: What's the biggest problem you deal with? On the issue of reboots, this is not really Microsoft's fault, nor is = the fault of Citrix. It is the fault of whoever developed your = applications and shipped them to you with resource leaks (memory, = handles, etc.). End user applications (which is what you run on your = Citrix servers) are fairy prone to leaks, which is why you generally = need to reboot those servers either nightly or weekly. Cheers, Bernd Harzog CEO RTO Software, Inc. bernd.harzog@xxxxxxxxxxx 678-455-5506 x701 www.rtosoft.com -----Original Message----- From: Luchette, Jon [mailto:JLuchette@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx]=20 Sent: Friday, February 13, 2004 4:33 PM To: 'thin@xxxxxxxxxxxxx' Subject: [THIN] Re: OT: OT: What's the biggest problem you deal with? "What's the biggest pain in the ass in the Citrix world?" That's easy, printing, hands down. Printing to every printer from every application = from every type of device. My biggest nightmare is getting calls from people trying to print from our main HIS application (I work at a hospital) = over citrix while using either a MAC client or a CE thin client. It sucks, = and that's all there is to it. As far as the reboot schedule... I think it is pretty ridiculous for = someone to think that they will never have to reboot their Citrix servers. They = are right, in a way, you shouldn't have to reboot Windows 2k servers in = general and we have many Win2k servers that don't ever need reboots, but when = you throw Citrix/Terminal Services in the mix with heavy usage, reboots to = me are considered mandatory. /jL -----Original Message----- From: Spencer Sun [mailto:ssun@xxxxxxxx]=20 Sent: Friday, February 13, 2004 2:45 PM To: thin@xxxxxxxxxxxxx Subject: [THIN] Re: OT: OT: What's the biggest problem you deal with? On a side note, I was wondering how many of you have a reboot schedule enable on your Metaframe farm. What OS and the how often you reboot. = IF you stagger the reboots in different parts of the farm, etc. I've a client who absolutely refuses to schedule reboots on the farm, = They have Windows 2000 farm and firmly believe that Windows 2000 does NOT = require reboots. I believe that part of the problem is that they do not want unattended reboots, as they are afraid servers will not come back up. = Seems kinda funky to me, but I wanted to get a feel for what the rest of the communicty is doing. Thanks Spencer -----Original Message----- From: Brian Madden [mailto:brian@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx] Sent: Friday, February 13, 2004 12:25 PM To: thin@xxxxxxxxxxxxx Subject: [THIN] OT: What's the biggest problem you deal with? Hello All, Since it's Friday I thought I'd ask something that I've been wondering = for a long time. I'm a consultant and I focus 100% on Citrix and server-based computing. While I work with a lot of different IT departments, I've never actually = had to run my own Citrix farm day after day. (Which means I'm either totally lucky or a total sham!) Anyway, as Citrix administrators, what's the one thing that's the = biggest pain in the butt in running your Citrix farms? Printing? AV? Security Patches? Profiles? Hmm. maybe I should say "other than the users, what's the biggest pain?" :-) Just curious, Brian Brian Madden brian@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx +1.202.302.3657 Visit <http://www.brianmadden.com> www.brianmadden.com for in-depth = Citrix, Terminal Server, and server-based computing news and analysis, white = papers, downloadable videos, and product reviews. ******************************************************** This weeks sponsor Vizioncore, Inc. --> vc-iMonitor - Performance Monitoring, Control & Reporting --> vc-iControl - Desktop & Start Menu Management & Reporting --> vc-iMapper - Drive, Printer & COM Management & Reporting http://vizioncore.com/products.html ********************************************************** Useful Thin Client Computing Links are available at: http://thethin.net/links.cfm *********************************************************** For Archives, to Unsubscribe, Subscribe or set Digest or Vacation mode use the below link: http://thethin.net/citrixlist.cfm ******************************************************** This weeks sponsor Vizioncore, Inc. --> vc-iMonitor - Performance Monitoring, Control & Reporting --> vc-iControl - Desktop & Start Menu Management & Reporting --> vc-iMapper - Drive, Printer & COM Management & Reporting http://vizioncore.com/products.html ********************************************************** Useful Thin Client Computing Links are available at: http://thethin.net/links.cfm *********************************************************** For Archives, to Unsubscribe, Subscribe or set Digest or Vacation mode use the below link: http://thethin.net/citrixlist.cfm ******************************************************** This weeks sponsor Vizioncore, Inc.=20 --> vc-iMonitor - Performance Monitoring, Control & Reporting=20 --> vc-iControl - Desktop & Start Menu Management & Reporting=20 --> vc-iMapper - Drive, Printer & COM Management & Reporting=20 http://vizioncore.com/products.html=20 ********************************************************** Useful Thin Client Computing Links are available at: http://thethin.net/links.cfm *********************************************************** For Archives, to Unsubscribe, Subscribe or=20 set Digest or Vacation mode use the below link: http://thethin.net/citrixlist.cfm ******************************************************** This weeks sponsor Vizioncore, Inc.=20 --> vc-iMonitor - Performance Monitoring, Control & Reporting=20 --> vc-iControl - Desktop & Start Menu Management & Reporting=20 --> vc-iMapper - Drive, Printer & COM Management & Reporting=20 http://vizioncore.com/products.html=20 ********************************************************** Useful Thin Client Computing Links are available at: http://thethin.net/links.cfm *********************************************************** For Archives, to Unsubscribe, Subscribe or=20 set Digest or Vacation mode use the below link: http://thethin.net/citrixlist.cfm ******************************************************** This weeks sponsor Vizioncore, Inc. --> vc-iMonitor - Performance Monitoring, Control & Reporting --> vc-iControl - Desktop & Start Menu Management & Reporting --> vc-iMapper - Drive, Printer & COM Management & Reporting http://vizioncore.com/products.html ********************************************************** Useful Thin Client Computing Links are available at: http://thethin.net/links.cfm *********************************************************** For Archives, to Unsubscribe, Subscribe or set Digest or Vacation mode use the below link: http://thethin.net/citrixlist.cfm ******************************************************** This weeks sponsor Vizioncore, Inc. --> vc-iMonitor - Performance Monitoring, Control & Reporting --> vc-iControl - Desktop & Start Menu Management & Reporting --> vc-iMapper - Drive, Printer & COM Management & Reporting http://vizioncore.com/products.html ********************************************************** Useful Thin Client Computing Links are available at: http://thethin.net/links.cfm *********************************************************** For Archives, to Unsubscribe, Subscribe or set Digest or Vacation mode use the below link: http://thethin.net/citrixlist.cfm -- No attachments (even text) are allowed -- -- Type: application/ms-tnef -- File: winmail.dat ******************************************************** This weeks sponsor Vizioncore, Inc. --> vc-iMonitor - Performance Monitoring, Control & Reporting --> vc-iControl - Desktop & Start Menu Management & Reporting --> vc-iMapper - Drive, Printer & COM Management & Reporting http://vizioncore.com/products.html ********************************************************** Useful Thin Client Computing Links are available at: http://thethin.net/links.cfm *********************************************************** For Archives, to Unsubscribe, Subscribe or set Digest or Vacation mode use the below link: http://thethin.net/citrixlist.cfm