[lit-ideas] Re: One fewer god
- From: Jack Spratt <dosflounder@xxxxxxxxx>
- To: lit-ideas@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
- Date: Sat, 26 Aug 2006 17:44:43 -0700 (PDT)
Thank you for the response.
In answer to your question; Karl and George, whose ideas and examples are the
seeds that have helped create the world of today. Both had good intentions,
like Jesus, but they launched thoughts and created power hungry followers that
commit death in their names. They in the final analysis are the reason you cry
out to god for 'justice' and blame culture for terrible acts. But Karl, George
were the First Cause and also men and men followed them, perverted them and
created the cultures we own.
I am not sure we should depend on any god to right any wrongs that we have
been caught up in. Call it the choices we make, fate or devine misguidance, as
you said we are alone. But if I am reading you correctly you are making
Pascal's wager and investing in the heavenly hedge fund. Good luck with the
vengeance thing.
J.S.
The one thing we lack is a handy utopia
Mike Geary <atlas@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
JS:
>>"If you examine all the alternative possibilities to gods (including Marx,
Mao, Hitler and Washington) you will see why gods are difficult to dismiss."<<
Is that Marx as in Brothers or Karl? And is that Washington the Washington
of George or DC? With Mao and Hitler there's no ambiguity. Their names are
eponymous for crimes against humanity. The very names cry out for a God more
than anything else I know of -- a cry for supernatural retributive justice.
Ah, yes -- but, so what? Justice? What does that mean? It means we're the
good guys, each and everyone of us, we all know that. Arab, Jew and Mexican
too, USA and Germany and (God love 'em) even Norway. We've all got God on our
side (though, due to his mysterious ways, He sure does take his own goddamn
time wreaking vengeance. Praise for a man's ashes is rather late, Lord -- as
Cicero or Cataline or Castro, whoever, once said. So too is vengeance. Do you
hear me, God? De profundis clamavi ad te, Domine. I personally want to see
the bastards who offended me suffer -- and gruesomely). Please don't take my
irritation with God's seeming lack of urgency in coming
to my defense as dismissive of religious belief. I don't believe in God at
all, but I do have enormous religious belief. Culture is religion after all.
Culture is the most horrendous religion of them all because culture defines
religion. Defines God! Yikes! You can be an atheist, if raised in the right
culture, but it's not possible to be an aculturalist. And so, as our culture
tell us, Gods are difficult to dismiss because the alternative is OUR SELVES
alone in an infinitely indifferent universe -- our lives amounting to no more
than an effervescent moment of organismic self-consciousness. We all want our
precious loves and elations and sorrows and sufferings to have everlasting
meaning. And we want vindication. For that we need a God. I have no problem
with that. God will, I trust, right the wrongs done to me -- eventually. And
they are many.
Mike Geary
20 years later
----- Original Message -----
From: Jack Spratt
To: lit-ideas@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Sent: Saturday, August 26, 2006 3:22 PM
Subject: [lit-ideas] Re: One fewer god
"If you examine all the alternative possibilities to gods (including Marx,
Mao, Hitler and Washington) you will see why gods are difficult to dismiss."
J.S.
The one thing we lack is a handy utopia.
Andreas Ramos <andreas@xxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
"I contend that we are both atheists. I just believe in one fewer god than
you do. When you
understand why you dismiss all the other possible gods, you will understand why
I dismiss
yours."
yrs,
andreas
www.andreas.com
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