[bksvol-discuss] Re: Downloading fair-rated books
- From: "Julie Morales" <mercy421@xxxxxxxxx>
- To: <bksvol-discuss@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
- Date: Mon, 15 May 2006 18:07:45 -0400
Hi, Jill. There was some discussion about that, but then, there was some
discussion about taking the HTML file and converting it to RTF, then losing
page breaks, so someone else will have to answer that if they haven't
already. Take care.
Julie Morales
Life is a gift from God. What we do with it is our gift to Him.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Jill O'Connell" <jillocon@xxxxxxxxxx>
To: <bksvol-discuss@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Monday, May 15, 2006 12:56 PM
Subject: [bksvol-discuss] Re: Downloading fair-rated books
Julie, Hopefully you can answer this for me. If I download a book in DAISY
format, can I then make corrections and resubmit? If I do, will this affect
the braille format as well?
----- Original Message -----
From: "Julie Morales" <mercy421@xxxxxxxxx>
To: <bksvol-discuss@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Sunday, May 14, 2006 9:57 PM
Subject: [bksvol-discuss] Re: Downloading fair-rated books
> Hi, Robin. I always download the BRF copy of the books and it's not
> advisable to work with that format if you plan to resubmit, so I haven't
> done that, but there are a few books, if ever I can, that I'd like to
> rescan. I think the few I've made note of, or at least more of them than
> not, are actually rated excellent, but as I've said, there were missing
> words, sometimes quite a few of them, and that just irritated me! <smile>
> I
> guess I can handle a few, but when it happens on every page or every other
> page and on most of the lines on that page, that's just too much. Take
> care.
> Julie Morales
> Life is a gift from God. What we do with it is our gift to Him.
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Robin Mandell" <robinmandell@xxxxxxxxxxx>
> To: <bksvol-discuss@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> Sent: Sunday, May 14, 2006 8:32 AM
> Subject: [bksvol-discuss] Re: Downloading fair-rated books
>
>
> I have actually corrected and resubmitted a few books that were rated
> good,
> or even excellent...in which there were scanning errors, and improperly
> inserted page breaks.
>
> At 10:20 PM 13/05/2006, you wrote:
>>Hi, Jill. Most of the time, I don't download them, either, unless it's one
>>I really want to read, but even then, I have to want to read it really
>>badly and have no other option for getting the book. Sometimes, I'm
>>pleasantly surprised and it's really not that bad, but there have been a
>>few times when books have slipped through the cracks and were rated better
>>than they should have been. Those are the ones that really frustrate me.
>>If something is rated fair and I choose to download it, anyway, at least I
>>can be prepared for what I might have to deal with, but really, I can't
>>blame any kind of automated tool for these books slipping through the
>>cracks. Some of the ones I've read recently had half a line or more
>>totally missing, but what was there was complete and did make sense, so no
>>automated tool would have picked up on that. Take care.
>>Julie Morales
>>Life is a gift from God. What we do with it is our gift to Him.
>>----- Original Message -----
>>From: <mailto:jillocon@xxxxxxxxxx>Jill O'Connell
>>To: <mailto:bksvol-discuss@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>bksvol-discuss@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>Sent: Saturday, May 13, 2006 6:08 PM
>>Subject: [bksvol-discuss] Re: Protecting page numbers and chapter headings
>>
>>I can't help wondering how many of us even download books marked fair or
>>even good; I know I don't.
>>----- Original Message -----
>>From: <mailto:donnafsmith@xxxxxxxxxxx>Donna Smith
>>To: <mailto:bksvol-discuss@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>bksvol-discuss@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>Sent: Saturday, May 13, 2006 10:32 AM
>>Subject: [bksvol-discuss] Re: Protecting page numbers and chapter headings
>>
>>Hi Evan and others following this thread.
>>
>>I apologize for being the one to open this particular can of worms. Every
>>time we've had this discussion on the list, it has brought up these same
>>issues. There is no official requirement for this from BookShare. The
>>goal is still to get as many books as possible in the collection following
>>the absolute guidelines regarding copyright laws as amended, and the
>>concern of quality is next in line with the understanding that it is
>>possible to rate books as fair, good or excellent.
>>
>>However, many of us who do the work have our own standards of quality for
>>our submissions and so we've come up with tips for how to get the best
>>quality possible. These standards, and they vary from volunteer to
>>volunteer, are not required by anyone. It's just a self-imposed standard.
>>
>>Personally, when I submit a book, I try to do as much clean-up as possible
>>so that the validator has an easy job. Actually, I try to submit the book
>>in a form I'd not mind reading. I knew from previous discussions on this
>>list that the BS software has little quirks that we can accommodate by
>>creating a particular format, though I had forgotten what that was
>>specifically. I choose to follow this pattern of blank line, page number,
>>blank line, text, or, false header, blank line, chapter heading, blank
>>line text, because it will produce a better end result for all formats,
>>but there is no requirement to do so. Volunteers can do as much as they
>>are comfortable with doing both as submitters and validators, and the
>>addition to the collection is appreciated by all.
>>
>>Hope this helps to explain it all a bit. Keep on scanning and keep up the
>>good work!
>>
>>Peace and Hope,
>>
>>Donna
>>
>>
>>----------
>>From: bksvol-discuss-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>[mailto:bksvol-discuss-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Evan Reese
>>Sent: Saturday, May 13, 2006 11:17 AM
>>To: bksvol-discuss@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>Subject: [bksvol-discuss] Re: Protecting page numbers and chapter headings
>>
>>Ok, now I'm more confused than ever. If I strip the headings manually,
>>then why does the stripper need something to strip. If I don't strip
>>them, then I need to make them consistent so the stripper can strip them
>>correctly? But if I do strip them, then I need to put a fake one at the
>>beginning of each chapter so the chapter heading doesn't get stripped? Do
>>I have this all correct? Wouldn't it be a lot simpler just to not strip
>>anything? Aren't we supposed - ideally anyhow - to be replicating the
>>original book, in which there is in fact a heading at the top of each
>>page, except on those which begin a chapter. This makes a lot of extra
>>work and complexity and a reduction of quality for those who can't keep
>>straight all the persnickety demands of the Bookshare software, or who
>>don't have the time to go through and fix everything just right so that
>>other readers can have a decent reading experience. I would say, just
>>drop the whole stripping thing and make life simpler for everyone and then
>>we won't have these quality problems.
>>
>>----- Original Message -----
>>From: <mailto:GeraldHovas@xxxxxxxxxxx>Gerald Hovas
>>To: <mailto:bksvol-discuss@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>bksvol-discuss@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>Sent: Friday, May 12, 2006 4:18 PM
>>Subject: [bksvol-discuss] Re: Protecting page numbers and chapter headings
>>
>>Donna,
>>
>>Yes, put a blank line before and after the page number when the page
>>number is in the header as well as a blank line at the bottom of the
>>page. I'm not sure if the blank line is necessary between the page number
>>and the text, but I can say that putting one after the header does work
>>well. If you leave the blank lines at the top and bottom of the pages
>>off, then some odd things will happen to the page numbers when the HTML
>>file is created. The page numbers end up as part of a paragraph instead
>>of on a separate line.
>>
>>Example of how the page should look...
>>
>>[Page Break]
>>
>>95
>>
>>.
>>.
>>.
>>text
>>.
>>.
>>.
>>
>>[Page Break]
>>
>>Yes, put a blank line between the chapter heading and the first line of
>>text. Again, I don't know that this is necessary, but it does work well,
>>and some people have said that it is necessary.
>>
>>3. Yes, you need to give the Stripper something to strip other than the
>>chapter heading or the chapter heading will be stripped. The easiest
>>thing to do when page numbers are normally at the top of pages except on
>>pages where a chapter begins is to move the page number from the bottom of
>>the page to the top. If page numbers are always at the bottom of the
>>page, then place a false header above the chapter heading. Using the
>>title works well, and it won't look as odd if the Stripper fails to strip
>>it for some odd reason. It helps to strip all of the real headers
>>manually since its easier to strip them yourself than to insure that they
>>are consistent so that the Stripper will remove them all, but if you do
>>leave them in, then just follow the pattern of the headers and put
>>whatever header would normally appear on the top of that page above the
>>chapter heading.
>>
>>Examples of how pages should look...
>>
>>[Page Break]
>>
>>95
>>
>>Chapter Seven
>>
>>.
>>.
>>.
>>text
>>.
>>.
>>.
>>
>>[Page Break]
>>
>>[Page Break]
>>
>>The Firm
>>
>>Chapter Seven
>>
>>.
>>.
>>.
>>text
>>.
>>.
>>.
>>
>>95
>>
>>[Page Break]
>>
>>Or if the page would normally contain the author's name instead of the
>>title...
>>
>>[Page Break]
>>
>>John Grisham
>>
>>Chapter Seven
>>
>>.
>>.
>>.
>>text
>>.
>>.
>>.
>>
>>[Page Break]
>>
>>I can't say that these are the only ways to do it, but I've had excellent
>>results with these approaches.
>>
>>HTH
>>
>>Gerald
>>
>>
>>----------
>>From: bksvol-discuss-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>[mailto:bksvol-discuss-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Donna Smith
>>Sent: Friday, May 12, 2006 5:41 PM
>>To: bksvol-discuss@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>Subject: [bksvol-discuss] Protecting page numbers and chapter headings
>>
>>Hi all.
>>
>>I hesitate to ask this question, but I can't find the answer on any of the
>>official or unofficial sites giving tips to scanners.
>>
>>Did we ever determine absolutely what should be done to protect page
>>numbers and chapter headings? What I want to know is:
>>
>>At the top of each page, do I need to put a blank line before and/or after
>>the page number?
>>For chapter numbers/titles that appear at the top of the page, do I put a
>>blank line before and/or after it?
>>Is it necessary to have something at the top of the page for the BookShare
>>stripper to strip?
>>
>>I spend a good bit of time cleaning up each scan regarding page numbers,
>>chapter headings and stripping out unwanted headers. I'm trying to do it
>>in such a way that it will result in the best book in the finished
>>product.
>>
>>I really, really hope that an answer has been found to this question and
>>that I'm not opening up the can of worms we've had before about the
>>different perceptions of what might work. <smile>
>>
>>Thanks.
>>
>>Peace and Hope,
>>
>>Donna
>>
>>
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