[access-uk] Re: How good is the KNFB reader
- From: "Karl Proud" <karl@xxxxxxxxxxx>
- To: <access-uk@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
- Date: Wed, 4 Feb 2009 14:06:36 -0000
If it is too expensive, then who is it too expensive for? What I mean is a
Samsung NC10 is too expensive for me but I don't think they have got their
price policy wrong, I think that I haven't got enough money - simple as
that.
I completely agree with you that some of the kit out their needs a lot of
thought before buying as sometimes I think I must be emitting a ton of radio
waves by carrying around all the electronic gadgets I have decided are
essential.
Karl
----- Original Message -----
From: "ANDY COLLINS" <Andy@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
To: <access-uk@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Wednesday, February 04, 2009 10:56 AM
Subject: [access-uk] Re: How good is the KNFB reader
Just because some people have bought it, is not an indication of it not
being too expensive! Just about all commercial products have competitors, so
if people can't afford the flashiest cars, there are still cars they can
afford that do the job, that goes for most commodities, however, in the case
of the KNFB reader, there is no real competition, it is a monopoly, and as
such, pretty much has it's customers over a barrel.
Benefits such as DLA are not meant for use in acquiring such technology, it
is provided to meet different needs altogether.
I guess it could be argued how much do those not in employment actually need
such software, as appose to wanting it because it would be nice to have? I
guess most can afford a flat bed scanner and OCR software such as
FineReader, so, how essential is OCR software on our phones, if we don't
really need it when out and about.
Those that are in employment are possibly in a better position to afford it
either from their own means, or through access to work.
Just trying to offer a balanced view here.
Personally I can afford it, but think it is heavily over priced; I would
like it, but don't actually need it. If it were priced where I think it
would be value for money, round about £399, then I would go for it; I feel
there are many in a similar position that might do the same, the company
needs to decide if it wants our custom, and if in the long term it would
make more from having more customers from selling at a more generally
affordable price.
I believe individually we need to be discerning about all this technology
stuff, sometimes there can be a desire to have every little thing just
because it's out there, I find there's just lots of stuff I don't need, I
might be interested in it, and curious to play with it, but in the end the
question for me is, once the novelty has worn off, will I actually use it,
does it enhance the quality of my life, or is it just another toy? -
Andy
----- Original Message -----
From: "Karl Proud" <karl@xxxxxxxxxxx>
To: <access-uk@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Wednesday, February 04, 2009 8:22 AM
Subject: [access-uk] Re: How good is the KNFB reader
> But what I am saying is that they can obviously run their business selling
> it at that price, what else should drive their pricing policy.
> I agree with you that it is very expensive, and I don't disagree with most
> of the points you mention, it's just the fundamental point of saying it is
> too expensive for people that I have a problem with as if some people have
> bought it then it isn't too expensive.
>
> I suppose I am questioning the idea of a social responsibility of the
> makers
> to get their kit into as many blind peoples hands as possible.
>
> Karl
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Ibrahim Gucukoglu" <ibrahim_gucukoglu@xxxxxxxx>
> To: <access-uk@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> Sent: Wednesday, February 04, 2009 7:10 AM
> Subject: [access-uk] Re: How good is the KNFB reader
>
>
> Hi Carl.
>
> I don't think you understand the point of what I am saying here. While I
> appreciate that access technology companies have to make a profit and as a
> result provide a highly developed and thought through piece of technology,
> for many these tools are difficult to obtain either because of their
> income
> or because in the eyes of the agencies that provide grants and funding,
> the
> ends don't justify the means. At the end of the day, you have bought a
> software upgrade and as you said you needed a quiet lie down, that is
> nothing compared to the cost of the KNFB reader for the phone. For one
> thing, jaws does more for you than KNFB reader ever would and for another
> thing screen readers for phones and GPS solutions cost half the price when
> bought together than the KNFB reader.
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Karl Proud" <karl@xxxxxxxxxxx>
> To: <access-uk@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> Sent: Wednesday, February 04, 2009 6:23 AM
> Subject: [access-uk] Re: How good is the KNFB reader
>
>
>> What has the amount of disability benefits got to do with pricing.
>>
>> Surely, if the piece of kit is overpriced no one will buy it and they
>> will
>> drop the price. I don't understand why access technology should be
>> priced
>> by non profit making standards.
>>
>> I have just upgraded my Jaws and bought an SMA and yes I now need a long
>> lie
>> down in a quiet room, but it's my choice - could have gone elsewhere.
>>
>> You get your stick free - what else do you want? <smile>
>>
>> Karl
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: "Ibrahim Gucukoglu" <ibrahim_gucukoglu@xxxxxxxx>
>> To: <access-uk@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>> Sent: Wednesday, February 04, 2009 5:02 AM
>> Subject: [access-uk] Re: How good is the KNFB reader
>>
>>
>> Hi James.
>>
>> While I appreciate that it is an everyday practical tool for some, price
>> is
>> certainly one of the biggest issues in access technology. Of course
>> different people have different needs, but access tech needn't be
>> expensive.
>> As I said to you and as others will surely agree, talks, mobile speaks
>> and
>> wayfinder are all invaluable tools to all mobile phone users yet they
>> don't
>> cost £695 or even close to that. Even if you were to buy a wayfinder and
>> talks or mobile speaks symbian license, the most you would ever pay would
>> be
>> £350, just over half the price of KNFB reader. While I agree that KNFB
>> reader is surely a wonderful tool, I think it is about time that the
>> price
>> of such tools should be evaluated to take in to consideration the number
>> of
>> visually impaired people who can ill afford it. To hammer the point
>> home,
>> I
>> believe code factory do a couple of tools for Symbian phones including a
>> colour detector, bar code scanner and even a daisy player and neither of
>> these cost as much as the KNFB software. Also, £695 is the average
>> monthly
>> take for someone on disability benefits. Jackie was certainly right when
>> she said about access technology pricing being an emotive issue.
>>
>> All the best, Ibrahim.
>>
>>
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: "James Scholes" <james@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>> To: "Edward Green" <access-uk@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>> Sent: Tuesday, February 03, 2009 10:51 PM
>> Subject: [access-uk] Re: How good is the KNFB reader
>>
>>
>>> Hi,
>>>
>>> While I agree with you all about the ridiculous price of the KNFB
>>> Reader,
>>> just think how much use you would get out of it? I know people who use
>>> it
>>> for all their reading needs, not just when they're out and about. So, I
>>> think before you go talking about how much it costs, just think, would I
>>> use it? If the answer is an outright yes, then the price shouldn't be an
>>> issue as it is an invaluable tool to most people.
>>>
>>> James Scholes
>>> http://www.jls-radio.com
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> Sent by Edward Green on Tuesday, February 03, 2009 at 10:19 PM
>>>
>>> Hi,
>>>
>>> I have to agree with Ibrahim for the unreasonable cost of the KNFB
>>> Reader.
>>>
>>> This is brought home by the fact that Abbyy, the producers of Fine
>>> Reader,
>>> make a program for Symbian phones that will scan business cards and OCR
>>> them
>>> for £10. It's a pity that they haven't expanded this to scan larger
>>> documents.
>>>
>>> This would require the makers of KNFB Reader to reassess their pricing
>>> policy.
>>>
>>> Ed
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: access-uk@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:access-uk@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf
>>> Of
>>> Peter Beasley
>>> Sent: 03 February 2009 13:22
>>> To: access-uk@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>> Subject: [access-uk] Re: How good is the KNFB reader
>>>
>>> I no that Jackie But there are a lot of us who don't have a job or are
>>> retired who have no sighted assistance.
>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>> From: "Jackie Cairns" <jackie.cairns@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>>> To: <access-uk@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>>> Sent: Tuesday, February 03, 2009 12:59 PM
>>> Subject: [access-uk] Re: How good is the KNFB reader
>>>
>>>
>>> Hi Peter
>>>
>>> I don't want to get into that, and it wasn't what Barry originally
>>> posted to enquire about.
>>>
>>>
>>> Jackie Cairns
>>> Braille Support Adviser
>>> Email: Jackie.Cairns@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>> Sight and Sound Technology
>>> Welton House North Wing
>>> Summerhouse Road
>>> Moulton Park
>>> Northampton
>>> NN3 6WD
>>> Telephone: 01604 798024
>>> Fax: 01604 798090
>>> Web: www.sightandsound.co.uk
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: access-uk@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:access-uk@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf
>>> Of Peter Beasley
>>> Sent: 03 February 2009 12:52
>>> To: access-uk@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>> Subject: [access-uk] Re: How good is the KNFB reader
>>>
>>> Pity more of us can't aford it.
>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>> From: "Jackie Cairns" <jackie.cairns@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>>> To: <access-uk@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>>> Sent: Tuesday, February 03, 2009 12:40 PM
>>> Subject: [access-uk] Re: How good is the KNFB reader
>>>
>>>
>>> Hi Barry
>>>
>>> Wearing my user hat, I think it's a great piece of kit. There are many
>>> occasions where I just can't be bothered to turn on the PC, or I've just
>>> turned it off and discover I need to scan something. The phone is great
>>> for that, and you can wear headphones for private listening.
>>>
>>> Like most things, there is a knack to using it, and once you grasp the
>>> concept of holding the phone above your document so that it takes a good
>>> picture of the text, then it really is very good.
>>>
>>> For what it's worth, I bought the original K-NFB Reader Classic long
>>> before I worked here, and was always interested in the phone version
>>> when it came out just before I started working for Sight and Sound, so
>>> I'm not advertising, merely giving you an honest user perspective as I
>>> see it. Honestly, it's one of my very favourite things.
>>>
>>>
>>> Jackie Cairns
>>> Braille Support Adviser
>>> Email: Jackie.Cairns@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>> Sight and Sound Technology
>>> Welton House North Wing
>>> Summerhouse Road
>>> Moulton Park
>>> Northampton
>>> NN3 6WD
>>> Telephone: 01604 798024
>>> Fax: 01604 798090
>>> Web: www.sightandsound.co.uk
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: access-uk@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:access-uk@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf
>>> Of Barry Hill
>>> Sent: 03 February 2009 11:52
>>> To: access-uk@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>> Subject: [access-uk] How good is the KNFB reader
>>>
>>> Hi all
>>>
>>> Although I do get quite a lot of information by email before meetings
>>> that I attend, there are the inevitable last minute documents that are
>>> handed out. I've read up on the KNFB Reader, but the blurb is by the
>>> makers and distributors, those with a vested interest.
>>>
>>> So, I was wondering what anyone who is actually using it thinks of it's
>>> performance. Does it read documents accurately? Is it quick and easy
>>> to use? Is it intrusive?
>>>
>>> Many thanks
>>>
>>> Barry
>>>
>>> ______________________________________________________________________
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>>>
>>> James Scholes
>>>
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>>> --
>>> Message sent at 10:48:22 PM GMT on Tuesday, February 03, 2009
>>>
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>>
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