[Wittrs] Re: Constituting Subjectivity
- From: "SWM" <SWMirsky@xxxxxxx>
- To: wittrsamr@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
- Date: Tue, 18 May 2010 02:58:59 -0000
--- In Wittrs@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx, Joseph Polanik <jPolanik@...> wrote:
>
> SWM wrote:
<snip>
> >The molecules of water aren't wet but in the aggregate, under certain
> >ambient conditions, when behaving in a certain way AND when observed at our
> >level or operation, wetness is encountered by creatures like us.
The
> >point is that the individual processes going on in the brain (or the
> >computer, if computers are viable substitutes for brains) aren't
> >conscious (don't experience subjectivity) but that, when aggregated
> >together in a certain way, under certain conditions, subjectivity
> >(including an experiencer experiencing it) occurs. This is what it
> >means to call this a system level feature. It is not found in the
> >constituents (below the level of the system in question) but only at
> >the level of all the constituents working together, doing their part.
>
> okay; but, isn't that just what you have called irreducibility?
>
> Joe
>
No. I've referred to "irreducibility" as the supposition that, whatever
consciousness is (e.g., features like understanding, imagining, being aware,
etc., -- or an aggregate of them), it cannot be explained as being the outcome
of events or activities or operations more basic than itself (i.e., not already
having the nature of those features). The molecules of water aren't wet at the
atomic level because there is no wetness as far as we know at that level. But
at our level of observation one of the features of the aggregation of the said
molecules, under certain conditions, is the phenomenon or feature we know as
"wetness".
This, by the way, comes straight from Searle, himself, though he uses it in a
different context, making a different point. When it comes to the CRA, however,
he seems to forget about this as a possible explanation for the occurrence of
consciousness in the universe and seems, instead, to entirely miss the point
that a system level explanation of consciousness, which sees consciousness as a
complex of features operating at a certain level, is not excluded from the
realm of possibility and may, indeed, offer the best explanation of what
consciousness is.
SWM
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