[TechAssist] Re: 220v: End of Discussion
- From: Joe Batchelor <jbc@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
- To: techassist@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
- Date: Sat, 21 Dec 2002 09:02:21 -0600
If the voltage is higher the current will be higher. I = E / R
Joe Batchelor CET TX-80
12/21/02 7:16:08 AM, "Vilhelm Boor" <villyboor@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
> . . . Again I have to come back shocked at the lack of knowledge displayed
> by some. . . . .
> Oh dear what did they teach you at school. . . . .
>> Voltage does not kill current does. It follows if the voltage is higher the
>> current will be lower.
>>. . . .
>>On Sat, 21 Dec 2002 01:01:27
>> Electric Medic wrote:
>>>
>>>Art:
>>>
>>>I think you know what I mean. I said 220vac, but 240vac was what I meant. I
>>>just followed the "Voltage" quoted in the subject line of the thread, which
>>>I did not start. And many layman call 110 for short I guess. Picking on
>>>close numbers just stirs controversy. But to keep it "Exact" we will say
>>>240. But even you should have got the jest. I did not know the fellow was
>>>from the West Indies since I started seeing this thread after the subject
>>>line was changed twice. I do have a question for you: Are you the "Great
>>>One" that must decide when a thread ends. We are all here to learn and help
>>>each other and I have tried to help many over the years on this and other
>>>forums. I have the Thank Yous in my inbox to prove it. I resent the few on
>>>here that feel the need to disrupt that with striking out against another.
>>>Whom decides what is interesting to a huge membership as this, just you?
>>>Please.
>>>
>>>Perry Bower
>>>Electric Medic
>>>"It's Cheaper to Keep Her"
>>>http://www.electricmedic.com
>>>Check out the Electronic Repair Screensaver We created. More Images to come!
>>>To download these Collections you must first install the Eyetide Viewer:
>>>http://www.eyetide.com/download/?s=O3OfmSLHXygGHCv1W6Gz3Bgjtq3DNNMNdcKsYSVGC
>>>"We're Number One Where it Really Counts, With our Customers"
>>>3850 Washington Road Suite 5b
>>>Martinez, Georgia 30907
>>>Phone: 706-8MEDIC4 (863-3424)
>>>Phone: 706-863-3474
>>>Fax: 706-863-2316
>>>mailto:info@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>>"WE REPAIR WITH CARE"
>>>
>>>SERVICE CENTERS PLEASE READ!!
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>>>5. Would you like to ship out less profitable products so you can repair
>>>others?
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>>>
>>>-----Original Message-----
>>>From: techassist-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>>[mailto:techassist-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx]On Behalf Of art bevilacqua
>>>Sent: Friday, December 20, 2002 11:44 PM
>>>To: techassist@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>>Subject: [TechAssist] Re: 220v: End of Discussion
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>Perry, you do not have 220 coming into your house. The nominal United
>>>States Standard distribution voltage for single phase power is 120/240
>>>Vac (120 Line to Neutral, 240 Line to Line). Look at the rating on your
>>>breaker panel, or check your copy of the National Electrical Code to
>>>confirm this.
>>>
>>>If you measure the voltage with your volt meter, you will likely see
>>>something either less than or greater than 120, the code also specifies
>>>an allowable range that the utility must stay within.
>>>
>>>Many other countries use 200 volt range supplies, here is a site that
>>>lists many of them, and gives the types of connectors commonly in use.
>>>
>>>http://kropla.com/electric2.htm
>>>
>>>If you look back at the original question, the person having the problem
>>>lives in the West Indies. West Indies doesn't appear in the web site
>>>referenced, but given the popularity of 220 Vac around the world, that's
>>>probably what he's got.=20
>>>
>>>As far as equipment, many devices are able to handle multiple voltages.
>>>Older equipment, stereos etc, had jumpers to reconfigure the supply
>>>connection to the primary of the power transformer.
>>>
>>>Newer stuff with switching supplies can vary their pulse widths to
>>>accommodate the higher input voltages. The limit would be the ratings of
>>>input diodes, caps, etc. but if the manufacture rated his stuff for
>>>100-240, he'd have the world licked.
>>>
>>>And sure enough, just for laughs, I've just looked at the five monitors
>>>in my office (1 sceptre, 2 HP's, 1 Panasonic, and 1 NEC) and every one
>>>of them has an input rating of 100-240 Vac, 50/60 Hz, making them
>>>saleable throughout the world.
>>>
>>>I hope this will solve the mystery once and for all.
>>>
>>>Later, art
>>>
>>>
>>>Art Bevilacqua
>>>Essex Radio and TV
>>>40 Main Street
>>>Essex, MA 01929
>>>abevilac@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>>
>>>
>>>-----Original Message-----
>>>From: techassist-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>>[mailto:techassist-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Electric Medic
>>>Sent: Friday, December 20, 2002 10:48 PM
>>>To: techassist@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>>Subject: [TechAssist] Re: 220v
>>>
>>>
>>>Yeah, we have 220 coming to our house, one 110 on one side of breaker
>>>box,
>>>and another 110 on the other side. I wired a special 220v outlet to my
>>>building outside. But in the tens of thousands of TV's that I have
>>>fixed, I
>>>have never had any customer that lived in the states say he used 220v on
>>>his
>>>TV. I don't know or care what they use overseas. I still can not figure
>>>out
>>>why anybody in the states would use 220v on a TV, and how they would
>>>even
>>>plug it in. I know the manual says this chassis will work on 220v, but
>>>why
>>>in the states? I am still confused about the member that says the CTC187
>>>works fine on 110v but hums on 220v. I have not seen it answered does he
>>>live in the states or overseas? Does he have two power cords or are they
>>>running 220v to a standard 110 outlet. I do not think I saw this
>>>addressed,
>>>or I missed many post.
>>>
>>>Perry
>>>Electric Medic
>>>
>>>-----Original Message-----
>>>From: techassist-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>>[mailto:techassist-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx]On Behalf Of Jeff Dougherty
>>>Sent: Friday, December 20, 2002 10:00 PM
>>>To: techassist@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>>Subject: [TechAssist] Re: 220v
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>Now wait...don't we all have 220 coming in to our homes now?
>>>If you have an electric range, it requires 220...two hots and a neutral.
>>>110vac is distributed to the rest of the wiring.
>>>This may be a little off topic for this list, but I still believe it to
>>>be
>>>an
>>>interesting topic...as well as a learning one.
>>>In-other-words, doesn't the step-down transformer send 220 to our
>>>panels?
>>>support@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>>FAX 717-564-4952
>>>Jeff Dougherty
>>>Intrepid Video & Electronics Be careful of your thoughts.
>>>501 Luther Rd They may become your words
>>>Harrisburg, PA 17111 any moment.
>>>717-909-8844
>>>VCR tips, electronics info & general interest.
>>>www.intrepid-video.com www.tech-repair.net
>>>www.thetoolcaddy.com www.9-11-2001tragedy.com
>>>***********************************************************************
>>>
>>>----- Original Message -----
>>>From: "Damon" <DAMON101@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>>>To: <techassist@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>>>Sent: Friday, December 20, 2002 6:52 AM
>>>Subject: [TechAssist] Re: 220v
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>This really doesn't make economical sense, tri-phase systems in
>>>residential
>>>areas??
>>>
>>>REALITY: 2 wires provide power, the only difference is the transformer
>>>setup
>>>that drops down the power to your home. In the land of 110 our
>>>transformer
>>>outputs 220V with a center tap that delivers 2 - 110V supplies or 1 -
>>>220V
>>>supply. (Hey, isn't that sweet....3 supplies in one, eh?).
>>>
>>>As for the european 220V supply system......I can only guess, but you do
>>>not
>>>have that Center-tap. And I really doubt that the electric company is
>>>going
>>>to use 2 wires for power, then strap on a 3rd wire for grounding
>>>purposes
>>>(what purpose would that serve, except to reference the metal toaster
>>>casing
>>>to your bathtub water??). I'm sure the 220V tranformers have no
>>>practical
>>>need for earth ground, since all the electronics would behave as though
>>>they
>>>had an "Isolation transformer" on them. (That's the stepdown
>>>transformer...outside your home).
>>>
>>>Personally, I've heard that 110V is more dangerous than 220V......but I
>>>don't see that as a logical argument...What.....110 has less voltage,
>>>therefore we enjoy holding onto it longer, thus toasting us, but not the
>>>europeans????
>>>If anybody has an answer to why 220 is safer than 110.... I'm listening.
>>>
>>>And that TRI-PHASE residential power supply??? Man, that is a load of
>>>hooey....of course, the government planners weren't reaching into their
>>>pockets, so I can assume they tapped into your dad's or grandad's
>>>wallet??
>>>
>>>Damon Brunger
>>>damon101@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>>Telrad Electronic Services
>>>Ft Wayne, IN 46815
>>>----- Original Message -----
>>>From: "Vilhelm Boor" <villyboor@xxxxxxxxx>
>>>To: <techassist@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>; <techassist@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>;
>>><techassist@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>>>Sent: Friday, December 20, 2002 8:29 AM
>>>Subject: [TechAssist] Re: 220v
>>>
>>>
>>>>
>>>> Villy Boor
>>>> Boorelec Durban
>>>> I have to come back with a post script, To get voltage for a TV at
>>>over
>>>200V would require you to use a transformer. I am sure there could be
>>>other
>>>methods using odd switching type devices but extremes of design like
>>>that
>>>would be nonsense as it would be cheaper to get the correct model. I can
>>>not
>>>see where the smoke would be derived if you stuck this on your TV as I
>>>am at
>>>a loss as to how you would hook it up.
>>>> On Fri, 20 Dec 2002 07:59:10
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>>
>>>> On Fri, 20 Dec 2002 07:59:10
>>>> Vilhelm Boor wrote:
>>>> >
>>>> >Villy Boor
>>>> > Boorelec Durban
>>>> > I am shocked that I know more about your power supplies in North
>>>America than seemingly you its residents do. North America works on 110V
>>>and
>>>you are stuck with that, tough its not as safe and losses are greater.
>>>Now
>>>you have a situation where you wish more voltage, you have to cheat The
>>>mains supply is 3 phase, it is usual to run a line down a street and try
>>>to
>>>balance the power by having house 1 on phase 1 house 2 on phase 2 etc.
>>>To
>>>get 220V you have to cheat, you use 2 phases so a plug has 2 live's. But
>>>why
>>>in the name of Freddy would we have to do that. Options on the back of
>>>TVs
>>>have gone, that requires you have a mains transformer, costs money is a
>>>no
>>>no. American TV is only viewable in America and a few other countries,
>>>the
>>>rest of us use the PAL system a much later and superior system, it
>>>follows
>>>then there is no requirement for your sets to work here or X. No we have
>>>standard 3 pin plugs (flat Pins pointing at 10 and 2 with an unused
>>>earth at
>>>6) nominal fuse volt
>>>> a
>>>>
>>>> > ge
>>>> > is 4A and there is no mystery
>>>> >--
>>>> >
>>>> >On Thu, 19 Dec 2002 21:54:26
>>>> > Julian Panizo wrote:
>>>> >>
>>>> >>In the countries with 220-240 V many sets have the 110 V option via
>>>switch
>>>> >>and a few have the voltage change automatic. The household wiring is
>>>two
>>>(2)
>>>> >>conductors, normally one hot and the other neutral, derived from a
>>>street
>>>> >>trifasic supply. In a few countries you get in some places 220 and
>>>others
>>>> >>110.
>>>> >>Julian
>>>> >>
>>>> >>Julian Panizo
>>>> >>C.C. 1867 Asunci=F3n Paraguay
>>>> >>Phone/Fax 595 21 601913
>>>> >>panizo@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>>> >>----- Original Message -----
>>>> >>From: "Electric Medic" <info@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>>>> >>To: <techassist@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>>>> >>Sent: Thursday, December 19, 2002 8:41 PM
>>>> >>Subject: [TechAssist] Re: 220v
>>>> >>
>>>> >>
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>> We STILL have not answered the QUESTION. Does this guys set work
>>>on
>>>> >>> 220volts. He said the set worked on 110v but not properly on 220v.
>>>I
>>>can
>>>> >>not
>>>> >>> believe that the set was designed to work on 220v using the same
>>>power
>>>> >>cord
>>>> >>> that came with the set. Every 220v circuit I have seen here in the
>>>states
>>>> >>> has a different cord (larger plug) with two hots. Is this some
>>>special
>>>> >>> CTC187AD. I think this is important enough to answer. We all know
>>>that
>>>220
>>>> >>> has to hots and a neutral, and 110 has one hot and a neutral. I am
>>>> >>> interested how in the world he is plugging a CTC187 into a 220v
>>>outlet.
>>>> >>> Please someone, or the owner of the set EXPLAIN. Everyone that I
>>>have
>>>seen
>>>> >>> will smoke if you apply 220v. This is driving me crazy. Why would
>>>anyone
>>>> >>> want to run his set on both 110v and 220v anyway? It seems to me
>>>if it
>>>> >>> worked on 110v, that should be good enough. Very confused here in
>>>Georgia.
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>> Perry Bower
>>>> >>> Electric Medic
>>>> >>> "It's Cheaper to Keep Her"
>>>> >>> http://www.electricmedic.com
>>>> >>> Check out the Electronic Repair Screensaver We created. More
>>>Images to
>>>> >>come!
>>>> >>> To download these Collections you must first install the Eyetide
>>>Viewer:
>>>> >>>
>>>>
>>>>>http://www.eyetide.com/download/?s=3DO3OfmSLHXygGHCv1W6Gz3Bgjtq3DNNMNdc=
>>>K
>>>sYSV
>>>GC
>>>> >>> "We're Number One Where it Really Counts, With our Customers"
>>>> >>> 3850 Washington Road Suite 5b
>>>> >>> Martinez, Georgia 30907
>>>> >>> Phone: 706-8MEDIC4 (863-3424)
>>>> >>> Phone: 706-863-3474
>>>> >>> Fax: 706-863-2316
>>>> >>> mailto:info@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>>> >>> "WE REPAIR WITH CARE"
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>> SERVICE CENTERS PLEASE READ!!
>>>> >>> 1. Are you currently backed up or over-loaded?
>>>> >>> 2. Are you short a tech or have one on vacation?
>>>> >>> 3. Do you need help with a very difficult repair?
>>>> >>> 4. Would you like to make money jobbing the work out?
>>>> >>> 5. Would you like to ship out less profitable products so you can
>>>repair
>>>> >>> others?
>>>> >>> If you answered Yes to any of the above questions, Checkout these
>>>> >>websites:
>>>> >>> http://www.electricmedic.com/salesa.htm
>>>> >>> or
>>>> >>> http://www.electricmedic.com/shipping.htm
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>> Factory Trained Authorized Service Center For: APEX, Fisher, GE,
>>>KEC/KTV,
>>>> >>> Konka, Mitsubishi, Panasonic, Philips Magnavox, Pioneer, ProSCAN,
>>>RCA,
>>>> >>> Samsung, Sanyo, Sharp, SONY, Technics, Toshiba, Zenith
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>> Provide Extended care for: AON, Circuit City, GE Contracts, Glass
>>>Agency,
>>>> >>> Philips Contracts, NEW, Rex
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>> -----Original Message-----
>>>> >>> From: techassist-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>>> >>> [mailto:techassist-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx]On Behalf Of Larry E.
>>>> >>> Sent: Thursday, December 19, 2002 2:11 PM
>>>> >>> To: techassist@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>>> >>> Subject: [TechAssist] Re: 220v
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>> Tommy, their talking about European tv sets not North American
>>>> >>> Larry Eastman
>>>> >>> American TV & Electronics
>>>> >>> Crystal River, Fl. 34428
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>> Hermantvr@xxxxxxxxxxxxx wrote:
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>> > Guys...I really don't know what you mean when you talk abut a TV
>>>using
>>>> >>> 220v.
>>>> >>> > On a 120v line you have a hot side and a neutral (0 volts) side.
>>>On
>>>a
>>>> >>240
>>>> >>> > line you have two hot sides.....believe me it will let the smoke
>>>out
>>>of
>>>> >>> yur
>>>> >>> > power supply filters.
>>>> >>> >
>>>> >>> > Tommy Herman
>>>> >>> > Herman TV
>>>> >>> > 250 School Ave SW
>>>> >>> > Taylorsville N.C. 28681
>>>> >>> > 828-632-5322 Voice
>>>> >>> > 828-632-3880 Fax
>>>> >>> >
>>>> >>> > If a TV requires 120 Watts of power, you could power it with
>>>120V, 1
>>>Amp
>>>> >>> > or 240V, 0.5A.
>>>> >>> >
>>>> >>> >
>>>> >>> > Gary McCartney
>>>> >>> >
>>>> >>> > McCartney Electronics
>>>> >>> > 7134 Fife Rd, RR 7
>>>> >>> > Guelph Ontario Canada N1H 6J4
>>>> >>> > Fax: (519)821-1530
>>>> >>> > email: gary (at) number63.ca
>>>> >>> >
>>>> >>> >
>>>> >>> >
>>>> >>> >
>>>> >>> > gulftech@xxxxxxxx wrote:
>>>> >>> >
>>>> >>> >>Dear Villy,
>>>> >>> >>
>>>> >>> >>Most of us know that formula as P =3D IE. Since current is
>>>directly
>>>> >>> >>proportional to voltage ( I =3D E/R), an increase in voltage
>>>yields a
>>>> >>> >>corresponding increase in current with R held constant. If
>>>current
>>>and
>>>> >>> >>voltage are both doubled, power is increased by a factor of 4.
>>>> >>> >>
>>>> >>> >>If I'm wrong, please set me straight.
>>>> >>> >>
>>>> >>> >>Regards,
>>>> >>> >>
>>>> >>> >>Ken Smith
>>>> >>> >>Gulf Technical Services
>>>> >>> >>3034 Gulf Breeze Parkway
>>>> >>> >>Gulf Breeze, FL 32563
>>>> >>> >>850-934-8324 (Voice) 850-932-0819 (Fax)
>>>> >>> >>
>>>> >>> >>On Thu, 19 Dec 2002 11:03:37 0000 "Vilhelm Boor"
>>><villyboor@xxxxxxxxx>
>>>> >>> >>writes:
>>>> >>> >>
>>>> >>> >>>Villy boor
>>>> >>> >>> Boorelec Durban
>>>> >>> >>> When I read some of this I am rather surprised, where were
>>>some of
>>>> >>> >>>you trained, what happened to Ohms law? Why 2 round prongs.
>>>Most
>>>> >>> >>>countries use various combinations of flat pin at various
>>>angles,
>>>> >>> >>>Round pins tended to have a bakelite body.
>>>> >>> >>> But please remember W=3DIV so the greater V is the less I =
>>>will
>>>be
>>>so
>>>> >>> >>>cables are lighter, plugs can be smaller and fuses lower I.
>>>Philips
>>>> >>> >>>for example make a wide range of TV with an input requirement
>>>of
>>>> >>> >>>from 90V to 270V, just plug it in and its working. I am
>>>sometimes
>>>> >>> >>>left speechless, this is your subject and livlihood, you must
>>>know
>>>> >>> >>>basics.
>>>> >>> >>>On Wed, 18 Dec 2002 19:43:29
>>>> >>> >>> teltek2 wrote:
>>>> >>> >>>
>>>> >>> >>>>No...Their 220 does not requite a huge plug like your
>>>dryer..just
>>>2
>>>> >>> >>>>
>>>> >>> >>>round
>>>> >>> >>>
>>>> >>> >
>>>> >>> > Tommy Herman
>>>> >>> > Herman TV
>>>> >>> > 250 School Ave SW
>>>> >>> > Taylorsville N.C. 28681
>>>> >>> > 828-632-5322 Voice
>>>> >>> > 828-632-3880 Fax
>>>> >>> > hermantvr@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>>> >>> > ------------------------------------------
>>>> >>> > Submit A Repair Tip For Everyone Here:
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>>>> >>> >
>>>> >>> >
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>> --
>>>> >>> Larry Eastman
>>>> >>> American TV & Electronics
>>>> >>> Crystal River, Fl.
>>>> >>> http://www.tvjunkyard.com
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>> ------------------------------------------
>>>> >>> Submit A Repair Tip For Everyone Here:
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>>>> >>>
>>>> >>
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>>>> >
>>>> >
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