Conrad, The Rx minimum eye width spec is a number that would usually be tied to a particular BER target spec; eg 0.2UI at 10e-12 BER. As you pointed out in your example, the resultant maximum allowable TJ of 0.8UI will be composed of a DJ number and 14*RJ for the Dual Dirac model at the 10e-12 BER level. For that combination of DJ and RJ, your eye margin at 10e-15 BER will obviously be smaller, and you can work out the margin using the 1UI -(DJ + 15.883*RJ) calculation. Note: this does not imply that jitter tolerance is increased. The tolerance to jitter hasn't changed at all, just your reference point for an eye margin measurement. If you really want 0.2UI of receiver eye margin at 10e-15 BER, then start with those numbers and you'll obviously calculate backwards to a wider eye margin at 10e-12. Martin Murphy Anritsu -----Original Message----- From: si-list-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:si-list-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Conrad Herse Sent: Monday, June 21, 2010 1:49 PM Cc: si-list@xxxxxxxxxxxxx Subject: [SI-LIST] Re: Rx Eye Mask width, BER, and Jitter Hi Jim, Maybe this is what's confusing me. The receiver specifies a jitter *tolerance*. From this an Rx minimum eye width can be determined. I would expect the min required eye width to *grow* when going to BER=1e15, since the receiver must *tolerate* more jitter. Making the min Rx eye mask smaller at BER=1e-15 doesn't seem correct, it implies the Rx jitter tolerance increases at 1e-15. Again, I'm referring to the Rx jitter tolerance and what the receiver requires, I understand that the actual eye size at the receiver will decrease when more jitter is budgeted into the system. Thanks, Conrad Herse James.Mueller@xxxxxxxxxx wrote: > Hi Conrad, > > When you went to calculate the mask size at BER= 1E-15, you added the > additional rms jitter contribution instead of subtracting. > > Jim > > > > James J Mueller > LeCroy Corporation > Cell phone: 914-522-8555 > > > > > From: Conrad Herse <herse@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> > > To: si-list@xxxxxxxxxxxxx > > Cc: herse@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx > > Date: 06/21/2010 03:41 PM > > Subject: [SI-LIST] Rx Eye Mask width, BER, and Jitter > > Sent by: si-list-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx > > > > > > > Hello experts, > > I've been working on trying to scale receiver eye mask widths to > different bit error rates. There is something which is puzzling me which > I'm hoping someone can clear up for me. > > I've been studying the dual-Dirac jitter model given by the formula: > > Tj = Dj + 2Q * Jrms > > where Q is a constant from the Complimentary Error function for a given > BER (2Q*Jrms = Rj at a specific BER). So if I have a receiver with the > following jitter tolerance spec: > > Tj = 0.8 UI > Dj = 0.3 UI > Rj = 0.5 UI > BER = 1e-12 > > then, given 2Q = 14 for BER = 1e-12: > > Jrms = 0.5 / 14 = 0.036 UI > > The Rx eye mask width would be: > > 1 - 0.8 = 0.2 UI > > If I want to scale the Rx eye mask width to BER=1e-15 I would expect I > need to *grow* the eye mask width by Jrms. > > Given that 2Q = 15.883 at BER = 1e-15, then my new eye mask width would be: > > 0.2 + (15.883 - 14) * 0.036 = 0.268 UI > > So far so good, assuming I did this correctly. Here's what puzzles me, > if I adjust my Rx jitter tolerance to accommodate the new Rx eye mask: > > Tj = 1.0 - 0.268 = 0.732 UI > Dj = 0.3 UI > Rj = 0.732 - 0.3 = 0.432 UI > BER = 1e-15 > > and recalculate Jrms: > > Jrms = 0.432 / 15.883 = 0.027 UI > > The Jrms number has changed, I wouldn't expect this to happen simply > because I'm extrapolating to a different BER. Can someone please > straighten me out? > > Thanks! > > -- > Conrad Herse > > ------------------------------------------------------------------ > To unsubscribe from si-list: > si-list-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx with 'unsubscribe' in the Subject field > > or to administer your membership from a web page, go to: > //www.freelists.org/webpage/si-list > > For help: > si-list-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx with 'help' in the Subject field > > > List technical documents are available at: > http://www.si-list.net > > List archives are viewable at: > //www.freelists.org/archives/si-list > > Old (prior to June 6, 2001) list archives are viewable at: > http://www.qsl.net/wb6tpu > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------ To unsubscribe from si-list: si-list-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx with 'unsubscribe' in the Subject field or to administer your membership from a web page, go to: //www.freelists.org/webpage/si-list For help: si-list-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx with 'help' in the Subject field List technical documents are available at: http://www.si-list.net List archives are viewable at: //www.freelists.org/archives/si-list Old (prior to June 6, 2001) list archives are viewable at: http://www.qsl.net/wb6tpu ------------------------------------------------------------------ To unsubscribe from si-list: si-list-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx with 'unsubscribe' in the Subject field or to administer your membership from a web page, go to: //www.freelists.org/webpage/si-list For help: si-list-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx with 'help' in the Subject field List technical documents are available at: http://www.si-list.net List archives are viewable at: //www.freelists.org/archives/si-list Old (prior to June 6, 2001) list archives are viewable at: http://www.qsl.net/wb6tpu