[SI-LIST] Re: HSPICE - adding jitter to ethernet serial link
- From: "Hassan O. Ali" <hassan@xxxxxxxx>
- To: si-list@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
- Date: Thu, 16 Feb 2006 16:11:31 -0500
Good enough!
Hassan.
On Feb 16, steve weir <weirsi@xxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>
> Hassan, thanks. I am just going to try and summarize. If I don't
> have this right, please correct me:
>
> The HSPICE method for APPROXIMATING effects of RJ to a truncated
> sigma value is injection of uncorrelated, or weakly correlated pseudo
> random timing variation into the model.
> The real time modelled only needs to be long enough to insure the
> correlation between data pattern and the pseudo RJ weak.
> The resulting eye closure will be close enough to what we would see
> in the real world to be useful.
>
> Best Regards,
>
>
> Steve.
> At 12:15 PM 2/16/2006, Hassan O. Ali wrote:
> >Steve,
> >
> >Please see my thoughts inline below.
> >
> >Best regards.
> >
> >Hassan.
> >
> >On Feb 16, steve weir <weirsi@xxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
> > >
> > > Hassan, thanks for the clarification. Now, what I would like to
> > > concentrate on is the notion of RJ injection in the simulaton
> > from two aspects:
> > >
> > > 1) How it can be done and
> > > 2) How useful could it be
> > >
> > > On the how, I think:
> > >
> > > 1) We have to modulate the timing of the transmit timing source, the
> > > path delay, or the receive slicer. I don't think we get there by
> > > making long PRBS sequences.
> >
> >Yes, the source pulse train is randomly changed by the jitter.
> >
> > > 2) That we never really get RJ because it is PRBS.
> > > Your thoughts?
> >
> >Doesn't have to be PRBS - it can be any pattern the interface is
> >supposed to work with.
> >The RJ is added, in random amounts, to advance or delay each rising
> >or falling edge or
> >the source. The pattern itself, and the source pulse distortion that
> >results from the
> >addition of the source RJ (and DJ), will allow for the evaluation of
> >the pattern channel-
> >dependency (i.e. ISI). I think that is a reasonable way of including
> >RJ in the jitter
> >analysis. Of course, you may disagree.
> >
> > > On the usefulness, I think
> > >
> > > It is dubious, because we can never get enough simulation cycles to
> > > see the RJ as it would really occur unless it is extreme. At best, I
> > > think we could create an eye for visual purposes that is compressed
> > > by applying whatever sigma we want to the RJ and convolving that peak
> > > value into a dummy jitter source. I am not sure how useful that
> > > might be. that is why I think mathematically working RJ in at post
> > > process makes more sense.
> > >
> > > Your thoughts?
> >
> >Many successful high-speed links have been designed using this
> >(HSPICE simulation)
> >method. As I mentioned before, the generation of the worstcase
> >far-end eye may not need
> >many simulation cycles. But of course there are more rigorous
> >methods that can be used
> >for the same purpose. However, when the only models you have are the
> >driver and receiver
> >HSPICE/IBIS models and the link model in S-parameter (or other)
> >format, the HSPICE
> >simulation approach maybe sufficiently used especially if you like
> >simplicity.
> >
> > >
> > > Best Regards,
> > >
> > >
> > > Steve
> > > At 07:30 AM 2/16/2006, Hassan O. Ali wrote:
> > >
> > > >Steve,
> > > >
> > > >So that we're all on the same page, let me summarize what I've
> > said so far:
> > > >
> > > >- In an HSPICE simulation you can inject into a link a PWL stimulus
> > > >that includes source
> > > >RJ and DJ, and obtain at the end of your link, a time-domain output
> > > >eye-diagram that
> > > >includes the effects of source RJ and DJ as well as the DJ
> > > >introduced by the link. I've
> > > >not suggested that such a simulation will give you a BER number.
> > > >
> > > >- With a known data pattern, and given BER requirements, I think it
> > > >is possible to
> > > >obtain the worst-case output eye-pattern (i.e. the worst-case
> > > >eye-closure) through
> > > >HSPICE simulation with just a few bits - i.e. not through days of
> > > >simulation. I
> > > >suggested that the simulation may need strategic assignment of
> > > >maximum RJ on the bit
> > > >stream. Of course that needs to be confirmed.
> > > >
> > > >Best regards.
> > > >
> > > >Hassan.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >On Feb 15, steve weir <weirsi@xxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > Hassan, using a PN pattern to emulate RJ doesn't make sense to
> > > > > me. In my perverse universe, lots of post processing is needed to
> > > > > convert an HSPICE result into an estimate of BER, most notably an
> > > > > accounting for the effects of RJ. Given the paradox that we desire
> > > > > both: near zero BER, and accurate BER values, I think it is hard
> > > > > enough to get valid probability stats on systems running full
> > > > > speed. In simulation, I see it as impossible outside of
> > > > > post-processing. And yes, accurate RJ numbers are critical to doing
> > > > > that post-processing reasonably well.
> > > > >
> > > > > Are you aware of an accurate way to get BERs based on the
> > > > > probabilistic effects without post processing? If you do, can you
> > > > > share a description?
> > > > >
> > > > > Regards,
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > Steve.
> > > > > At 06:00 PM 2/15/2006, Hassan O. Ali wrote:
> > > > > >Chris,
> > > > > >
> > > > > >There are so many ways to skin a cat!
> > > > > >
> > > > > >High-speed chip makers do specify Tx RJ and DJ (jitter generation)
> > > > > >numbers and also Rx
> > > > > >jitter tolerance numbers. As a matter of fact, various high-speed
> > > > > >interface standards
> > > > > >call for the specification of those jitter characteristics. System
> > > > > >designers use those
> > > > > >numbers while evaluating the performance over their links.
> > > > > >
> > > > > >The jitter tolerance number is a measure of the Rx performance. An
> > > > > >HSPICE simulation may
> > > > > >not easily give you a BER number but it gives you an eye-pattern at
> > > > > >the end of the link
> > > > > >which you can use to determine if it meets the far-end eye-pattern
> > > > > >expected by the
> > > > > >receiver.
> > > > > >
> > > > > >Best regards.
> > > > > >
> > > > > >Hassan.
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > >On Feb 15, "Chris Cheng" <Chris.Cheng@xxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > I am a firm believer of divide and conquer. The same
> > reason you don't =
> > > > > > > simulate your Tx/Rx PLL jitter while you are doing your
> > prop delay =
> > > > > > > analysis. They are separate components of a BERT budget. You
> > > > are asking =
> > > > > > > for trouble and unnecessary complexity if you try to do
> > it all in the =
> > > > > > > same time in SPICE or IBIS.
> > > > > > > Besides, who really knows what his Tx Rj is anyways ?
> > > > > > > Further more, without knowing your CDR jitter transfer, how
> > > > do you know =
> > > > > > > the BERT is really that bad AFTER your CDR recover the
> > clock that is =
> > > > > > > used to capture your data ?
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > -----Original Message-----
> > > > > > > From: si-list-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> > > > > > > [mailto:si-list-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx]On Behalf Of Hassan O. Ali
> > > > > > > Sent: Wednesday, February 15, 2006 3:05 PM
> > > > > > > To: si-list@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> > > > > > > Subject: [SI-LIST] Re: HSPICE - adding jitter to ethernet
> > serial link
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > I don't know how the two methods would compare. What do you think?
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Best regards.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Hassan.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > On Feb 15, "Chris Cheng" <Chris.Cheng@xxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
> > > > > > > >=20
> > > > > > > > If the channel is indeed linear, what's the difference
> > between not =
> > > > > > > doing =3D
> > > > > > > > Rj at all and simulate your PRBS, get the minium eye
> > > > opening (Dj) then =
> > > > > > > =3D
> > > > > > > > add a seperate Rj convoluted with impulse response ?=3D20
> > > > > > > >=20
> > > > > > > > -----Original Message-----
> > > > > > > > From: si-list-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> > > > > > > > [mailto:si-list-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx]On Behalf Of Hassan O. Ali
> > > > > > > > Sent: Wednesday, February 15, 2006 2:18 PM
> > > > > > > > To: si-list@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> > > > > > > > Subject: [SI-LIST] Re: HSPICE - adding jitter to
> > ethernet serial link
> > > > > > > >=20
> > > > > > > >=20
> > > > > > > > Chris,
> > > > > > > >=20
> > > > > > > > The HSPICE approach allows you to see the effect of source
> > > > RJ as well =
> > > > > > > as =3D
> > > > > > > > both source and=3D20
> > > > > > > > channel-induced DJ. I think the convolution you're referring to
> > > > > > > > =
> > > > > > > doesn't =3D
> > > > > > > > consider source=3D20
> > > > > > > > DJ.
> > > > > > > >=20
> > > > > > > > I'm thinking out loud here, but I think in simulation,
> > if the input =
> > > > > > > =3D
> > > > > > > > pattern is known, it=3D20
> > > > > > > > doesn't need many bits to simulate a case of worst-case
> > > > jitter (or =3D
> > > > > > > > eye-opening) for a=3D20
> > > > > > > > particular BER requirement.=3D20
> > > > > > > >=20
> > > > > > > > For example, for a BER of 10E-14, the max pk-to-pk RJ is
> > > > approx. 15.3 =
> > > > > > > =3D
> > > > > > > > times RJ(rms). To=3D20
> > > > > > > > simulate the worst-case total jitter, In the PWL source you
> > > > could use =
> > > > > > > =3D
> > > > > > > > that amount of max=3D20
> > > > > > > > pk-to-pk RJ right at the bit where you expect the
> > > > worst-case ISI e.g. =
> > > > > > > at =3D
> > > > > > > > a lone "1" that=3D20
> > > > > > > > follows a long run of 0's. In other words, I think you can =
> > > > > > > strategically =3D
> > > > > > > > define source=3D20
> > > > > > > > RJ and DJ amounts along your bit stream and cover the entire =
> > > > > > > eye-pattern =3D
> > > > > > > > voltage/time=3D20
> > > > > > > > bounds in just a few bits. Anyone out there has done this?
> > > > > > > >=20
> > > > > > > > Best regards.
> > > > > > > >=20
> > > > > > > > Hassan.
> > > > > > > >=20
> > > > > > > >=20
> > > > > > > >=20
> > > > > > > > On Feb 15, "Chris Cheng" <Chris.Cheng@xxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
> > > > > > > > >=3D20
> > > > > > > > > If your channel response is linear. How does a
> > separate analysis =
> > > > > > > with =3D
> > > > > > > > Rj only=3D20
> > > > > > > > convoluted with the impulse response of the channel
> > different from =
> > > > > > > what =3D
> > > > > > > > you are doing ?=3D20
> > > > > > > > How many bit do you think is need to simulate in SPICE
> > a BERT of =
> > > > > > > 10e-14 =3D
> > > > > > > > or -18 ?
> > > > > > > > > =3D20
> > > > > > > > > ________________________________
> > > > > > > > >=3D20
> > > > > > > > > From: si-list-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx on behalf of Hassan O. Ali
> > > > > > > > > Sent: Wed 2/15/2006 9:02 AM
> > > > > > > > > To: si-list@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> > > > > > > > > Subject: [SI-LIST] Re: HSPICE - adding jitter to
> > ethernet serial =
> > > > > > > link
> > > > > > > > >=3D20
> > > > > > > > >=3D20
> > > > > > > > >=3D20
> > > > > > > > > A piece-wise linear (PWL) source implemented as below in
> > > > an HSPICE =
> > > > > > > =3D
> > > > > > > > subcircuit may be
> > > > > > > > > used to simulate RJ and DJ effects on the output.
> > > > > > > > >=3D20
> > > > > > > > > The total jitter (J) factors (e.g. 0.512, 0.221, etc.) in
> > > > this case =
> > > > > > > =3D
> > > > > > > > were generated with
> > > > > > > > > a random number generator. The bit pattern is random but
> > > > is supposed =
> > > > > > > =3D
> > > > > > > > to mimic an 8B/10B
> > > > > > > > > encoding where the maximum run-length (maximum number of
> > > > consecutive =
> > > > > > > =3D
> > > > > > > > 1's or 0's) is 5.
> > > > > > > > > The pattern length was arbitrarily chosen as 160 bits.
> > > > > > > > >=3D20
> > > > > > > > > Mind you, this is just one arbitrary way of including
> > DJ and RJ =3D
> > > > > > > > effects. I'm sure more
> > > > > > > > > elaborate ways exist.
> > > > > > > > >=3D20
> > > > > > > > > Best regards.
> > > > > > > > >=3D20
> > > > > > > > > Hassan.
> > > > > > > > >=3D20
> > > > > > > > >=3D20
> > > > > > > > > ************************************************
> > > > > > > > > * HSPICE PWL voltage source
> > > > > > > > > * Parameter description:
> > > > > > > > > * TR - Rise/Fall time of the PWL source
> > > > > > > > > * UI - Unit Interval time (Bit width =3D3D 1/BitRate)
> > > > > > > > > * HI - Voltage value representing bit "1"
> > > > > > > > > * LO - Voltage value representing bit "0"
> > > > > > > > > * JD - Peak-to-peak deterministic jitter
> > > > > > > > > * JR - Peak-to-peak random jitter
> > > > > > > > > ************************************************
> > > > > > > > > .SUBCKT pwl_source node1 node2
> > > > > > > > > +TR=3D3DTRval UI=3D3DUIval HI=3D3DHIval LO=3D3DLOval
> > > > > > > > > +JD=3D3DJDval JR=3D3DJRval
> > > > > > > > > .param J=3D3D'(JD+JR/2)'
> > > > > > > > > vsrc node1 node2 PWL
> > > > > > > > > + 0.0 'HI', '0.512*J+UI*1' 'HI',
> > > > > > > > > + '0.512*J+UI*1+TR' 'LO', '0.221*J+UI*2' 'LO',
> > > > > > > > > + '0.221*J+UI*2+TR' 'LO', '0.868*J+UI*3' 'LO',
> > > > > > > > > + '0.868*J+UI*3+TR' 'LO', '0.358*J+UI*4' 'LO',
> > > > > > > > > + '0.358*J+UI*4+TR' 'LO', '0.379*J+UI*5' 'LO',
> > > > > > > > > + '0.379*J+UI*5+TR' 'HI', '-0.003*J+UI*6' 'HI',
> > > > > > > > > + '-0.003*J+UI*6+TR' 'LO', '0.2*J+UI*7' 'LO',
> > > > > > > > > + '0.2*J+UI*7+TR' 'LO', '0.238*J+UI*8' 'LO',
> > > > > > > > > + '0.238*J+UI*8+TR' 'LO', '0.197*J+UI*9' 'LO',
> > > > > > > > > + '0.197*J+UI*9+TR' 'LO', '-0.424*J+UI*10' 'LO',
> > > > > > > > > + '-0.424*J+UI*10+TR' 'HI', '-0.608*J+UI*11' 'HI',
> > > > > > > > > + '-0.608*J+UI*11+TR' 'HI', '-0.47*J+UI*12' 'HI',
> > > > > > > > > + '-0.47*J+UI*12+TR' 'LO', '-0.124*J+UI*13' 'LO',
> > > > > > > > > + '-0.124*J+UI*13+TR' 'LO', '-0.094*J+UI*14' 'LO',
> > > > > > > > > + '-0.094*J+UI*14+TR' 'LO', '-0.657*J+UI*15' 'LO',
> > > > > > > > > + '-0.657*J+UI*15+TR' 'HI', '0.48*J+UI*16' 'HI',
> > > > > > > > > + '0.48*J+UI*16+TR' 'LO', '-0.052*J+UI*17' 'LO',
> > > > > > > > > + '-0.052*J+UI*17+TR' 'LO', '0.208*J+UI*18' 'LO',
> > > > > > > > > + '0.208*J+UI*18+TR' 'HI', '-0.15*J+UI*19' 'HI',
> > > > > > > > > + '-0.15*J+UI*19+TR' 'HI', '-0.097*J+UI*20' 'HI',
> > > > > > > > > + '-0.097*J+UI*20+TR' 'LO', '0.089*J+UI*21' 'LO',
> > > > > > > > > + '0.089*J+UI*21+TR' 'LO', '-0.535*J+UI*22' 'LO',
> > > > > > > > > + '-0.535*J+UI*22+TR' 'LO', '0.096*J+UI*23' 'LO',
> > > > > > > > > + '0.096*J+UI*23+TR' 'LO', '-0.433*J+UI*24' 'LO',
> > > > > > > > > + '-0.433*J+UI*24+TR' 'LO', '0.603*J+UI*25' 'LO',
> > > > > > > > > + '0.603*J+UI*25+TR' 'LO', '-0.119*J+UI*26' 'LO',
> > > > > > > > > + '-0.119*J+UI*26+TR' 'HI', '-0.847*J+UI*27' 'HI',
> > > > > > > > > + '-0.847*J+UI*27+TR' 'HI', '-0.234*J+UI*28' 'HI',
> > > > > > > > > + '-0.234*J+UI*28+TR' 'HI', '-0.056*J+UI*29' 'HI',
> > > > > > > > > + '-0.056*J+UI*29+TR' 'LO', '-0.535*J+UI*30' 'LO',
> > > > > > > > > + '-0.535*J+UI*30+TR' 'LO', '-0.564*J+UI*31' 'LO',
> > > > > > > > > + '-0.564*J+UI*31+TR' 'HI', '-0.191*J+UI*32' 'HI',
> > > > > > > > > + '-0.191*J+UI*32+TR' 'LO', '0.16*J+UI*33' 'LO',
> > > > > > > > > + '0.16*J+UI*33+TR' 'LO', '-0.552*J+UI*34' 'LO',
> > > > > > > > > + '-0.552*J+UI*34+TR' 'LO', '0.277*J+UI*35' 'LO',
> > > > > > > > > + '0.277*J+UI*35+TR' 'HI', '-0.491*J+UI*36' 'HI',
> > > > > > > > > + '-0.491*J+UI*36+TR' 'LO', '0.463*J+UI*37' 'LO',
> > > > > > > > > + '0.463*J+UI*37+TR' 'LO', '-0.166*J+UI*38' 'LO',
> > > > > > > > > + '-0.166*J+UI*38+TR' 'HI', '-0.592*J+UI*39' 'HI',
> > > > > > > > > + '-0.592*J+UI*39+TR' 'HI', '0.667*J+UI*40' 'HI',
> > > > > > > > > + '0.667*J+UI*40+TR' 'LO', '-0.296*J+UI*41' 'LO',
> > > > > > > > > + '-0.296*J+UI*41+TR' 'LO', '-0.11*J+UI*42' 'LO',
> > > > > > > > > + '-0.11*J+UI*42+TR' 'HI', '-0.608*J+UI*43' 'HI',
> > > > > > > > > + '-0.608*J+UI*43+TR' 'HI', '-0.351*J+UI*44' 'HI',
> > > > > > > > > + '-0.351*J+UI*44+TR' 'LO', '0.818*J+UI*45' 'LO',
> > > > > > > > > + '0.818*J+UI*45+TR' 'HI', '-0.365*J+UI*46' 'HI',
> > > > > > > > > + '-0.365*J+UI*46+TR' 'LO', '0.201*J+UI*47' 'LO',
> > > > > > > > > + '0.201*J+UI*47+TR' 'LO', '-0.247*J+UI*48' 'LO',
> > > > > > > > > + '-0.247*J+UI*48+TR' 'LO', '0.446*J+UI*49' 'LO',
> > > > > > > > > + '0.446*J+UI*49+TR' 'HI', '0.329*J+UI*50' 'HI',
> > > > > > > > > + '0.329*J+UI*50+TR' 'LO', '0.706*J+UI*51' 'LO',
> > > > > > > > > + '0.706*J+UI*51+TR' 'HI', '-0.165*J+UI*52' 'HI',
> > > > > > > > > + '-0.165*J+UI*52+TR' 'LO', '0.302*J+UI*53' 'LO',
> > > > > > > > > + '0.302*J+UI*53+TR' 'LO', '0.03*J+UI*54' 'LO',
> > > > > > > > > + '0.03*J+UI*54+TR' 'HI', '0.152*J+UI*55' 'HI',
> > > > > > > > > + '0.152*J+UI*55+TR' 'LO', '-0.255*J+UI*56' 'LO',
> > > > > > > > > + '-0.255*J+UI*56+TR' 'HI', '-0.237*J+UI*57' 'HI',
> > > > > > > > > + '-0.237*J+UI*57+TR' 'LO', '0.014*J+UI*58' 'LO',
> > > > > > > > > + '0.014*J+UI*58+TR' 'LO', '0.64*J+UI*59' 'LO',
> > > > > > > > > + '0.64*J+UI*59+TR' 'LO', '-0.162*J+UI*60' 'LO',
> > > > > > > > > + '-0.162*J+UI*60+TR' 'LO', '0.311*J+UI*61' 'LO',
> > > > > > > > > + '0.311*J+UI*61+TR' 'LO', '0.33*J+UI*62' 'LO',
> > > > > > > > > + '0.33*J+UI*62+TR' 'LO', '-0.301*J+UI*63' 'LO',
> > > > > > > > > + '-0.301*J+UI*63+TR' 'HI', '-0.513*J+UI*64' 'HI',
> > > > > > > > > + '-0.513*J+UI*64+TR' 'LO', '0.102*J+UI*65' 'LO',
> > > > > > > > > + '0.102*J+UI*65+TR' 'LO', '-0.695*J+UI*66' 'LO',
> > > > > > > > > + '-0.695*J+UI*66+TR' 'LO', '-0.308*J+UI*67' 'LO',
> > > > > > > > > + '-0.308*J+UI*67+TR' 'LO', '-0.444*J+UI*68' 'LO',
> > > > > > > > > + '-0.444*J+UI*68+TR' 'LO', '0.387*J+UI*69' 'LO',
> > > > > > > > > + '0.387*J+UI*69+TR' 'LO', '-0.031*J+UI*70' 'LO',
> > > > > > > > > + '-0.031*J+UI*70+TR' 'HI', '-0.599*J+UI*71' 'HI',
> > > > > > > > > + '-0.599*J+UI*71+TR' 'LO', '-0.071*J+UI*72' 'LO',
> > > > > > > > > + '-0.071*J+UI*72+TR' 'LO', '0.077*J+UI*73' 'LO',
> > > > > > > > > + '0.077*J+UI*73+TR' 'HI', '0.663*J+UI*74' 'HI',
> > > > > > > > > + '0.663*J+UI*74+TR' 'HI', '-0.526*J+UI*75' 'HI',
> > > > > > > > > + '-0.526*J+UI*75+TR' 'LO', '0*J+UI*76' 'LO',
> > > > > > > > > + '0*J+UI*76+TR' 'LO', '0.193*J+UI*77' 'LO',
> > > > > > > > > + '0.193*J+UI*77+TR' 'LO', '0.479*J+UI*78' 'LO',
> > > > > > > > > + '0.479*J+UI*78+TR' 'LO', '-0.055*J+UI*79' 'LO',
> > > > > > > > > + '-0.055*J+UI*79+TR' 'HI', '0.161*J+UI*80' 'HI',
> > > > > > > > > + '0.161*J+UI*80+TR' 'LO', '0.404*J+UI*81' 'LO',
> > > > > > > > > + '0.404*J+UI*81+TR' 'LO', '-0.249*J+UI*82' 'LO',
> > > > > > > > > + '-0.249*J+UI*82+TR' 'HI', '-0.255*J+UI*83' 'HI',
> > > > > > > > > + '-0.255*J+UI*83+TR' 'LO', '-0.668*J+UI*84' 'LO',
> > > > > > > > > + '-0.668*J+UI*84+TR' 'HI', '-0.481*J+UI*85' 'HI',
> > > > > > > > > + '-0.481*J+UI*85+TR' 'LO', '0.553*J+UI*86' 'LO',
> > > > > > > > > + '0.553*J+UI*86+TR' 'LO', '0.16*J+UI*87' 'LO',
> > > > > > > > > + '0.16*J+UI*87+TR' 'HI', '0.392*J+UI*88' 'HI',
> > > > > > > > > + '0.392*J+UI*88+TR' 'LO', '-0.056*J+UI*89' 'LO',
> > > > > > > > > + '-0.056*J+UI*89+TR' 'LO', '0.267*J+UI*90' 'LO',
> > > > > > > > > + '0.267*J+UI*90+TR' 'LO', '0.384*J+UI*91' 'LO',
> > > > > > > > > + '0.384*J+UI*91+TR' 'LO', '0.79*J+UI*92' 'LO',
> > > > > > > > > + '0.79*J+UI*92+TR' 'LO', '-0.734*J+UI*93' 'LO',
> > > > > > > > > + '-0.734*J+UI*93+TR' 'LO', '-0.006*J+UI*94' 'LO',
> > > > > > > > > + '-0.006*J+UI*94+TR' 'HI', '-0.01*J+UI*95' 'HI',
> > > > > > > > > + '-0.01*J+UI*95+TR' 'HI', '-0.039*J+UI*96' 'HI',
> > > > > > > > > + '-0.039*J+UI*96+TR' 'LO', '0.648*J+UI*97' 'LO',
> > > > > > > > > + '0.648*J+UI*97+TR' 'HI', '0.099*J+UI*98' 'HI',
> > > > > > > > > + '0.099*J+UI*98+TR' 'LO', '0.409*J+UI*99' 'LO',
> > > > > > > > > + '0.409*J+UI*99+TR' 'HI', '0.808*J+UI*100' 'HI',
> > > > > > > > > + '0.808*J+UI*100+TR' 'HI', '0.458*J+UI*101' 'HI',
> > > > > > > > > + '0.458*J+UI*101+TR' 'LO', '0.709*J+UI*102' 'LO',
> > > > > > > > > + '0.709*J+UI*102+TR' 'LO', '0.489*J+UI*103' 'LO',
> > > > > > > > > + '0.489*J+UI*103+TR' 'HI', '0.309*J+UI*104' 'HI',
> > > > > > > > > + '0.309*J+UI*104+TR' 'LO', '0.637*J+UI*105' 'LO',
> > > > > > > > > + '0.637*J+UI*105+TR' 'LO', '0.225*J+UI*106' 'LO',
> > > > > > > > > + '0.225*J+UI*106+TR' 'LO', '-0.052*J+UI*107' 'LO',
> > > > > > > > > + '-0.052*J+UI*107+TR' 'HI', '-0.1*J+UI*108' 'HI',
> > > > > > > > > + '-0.1*J+UI*108+TR' 'HI', '0.288*J+UI*109' 'HI',
> > > > > > > > > + '0.288*J+UI*109+TR' 'LO', '-0.219*J+UI*110' 'LO',
> > > > > > > > > + '-0.219*J+UI*110+TR' 'LO', '-0.129*J+UI*111' 'LO',
> > > > > > > > > + '-0.129*J+UI*111+TR' 'LO', '0.035*J+UI*112' 'LO',
> > > > > > > > > + '0.035*J+UI*112+TR' 'LO', '0.131*J+UI*113' 'LO',
> > > > > > > > > + '0.131*J+UI*113+TR' 'HI', '-0.23*J+UI*114' 'HI',
> > > > > > > > > + '-0.23*J+UI*114+TR' 'LO', '0.24*J+UI*115' 'LO',
> > > > > > > > > + '0.24*J+UI*115+TR' 'LO', '0.684*J+UI*116' 'LO',
> > > > > > > > > + '0.684*J+UI*116+TR' 'LO', '0.027*J+UI*117' 'LO',
> > > > > > > > > + '0.027*J+UI*117+TR' 'HI', '0.351*J+UI*118' 'HI',
> > > > > > > > > + '0.351*J+UI*118+TR' 'LO', '-0.562*J+UI*119' 'LO',
> > > > > > > > > + '-0.562*J+UI*119+TR' 'LO', '0.831*J+UI*120' 'LO',
> > > > > > > > > + '0.831*J+UI*120+TR' 'LO', '-0.524*J+UI*121' 'LO',
> > > > > > > > > + '-0.524*J+UI*121+TR' 'HI', '-0.041*J+UI*122' 'HI',
> > > > > > > > > + '-0.041*J+UI*122+TR' 'HI', '0.675*J+UI*123' 'HI',
> > > > > > > > > + '0.675*J+UI*123+TR' 'HI', '-0.035*J+UI*124' 'HI',
> > > > > > > > > + '-0.035*J+UI*124+TR' 'HI', '0.083*J+UI*125' 'HI',
> > > > > > > > > + '0.083*J+UI*125+TR' 'LO', '-0.247*J+UI*126' 'LO',
> > > > > > > > > + '-0.247*J+UI*126+TR' 'HI', '-0.372*J+UI*127' 'HI',
> > > > > > > > > + '-0.372*J+UI*127+TR' 'LO', '-0.44*J+UI*128' 'LO',
> > > > > > > > > + '-0.44*J+UI*128+TR' 'HI', '-0.861*J+UI*129' 'HI',
> > > > > > > > > + '-0.861*J+UI*129+TR' 'LO', '0.162*J+UI*130' 'LO',
> > > > > > > > > + '0.162*J+UI*130+TR' 'HI', '-0.228*J+UI*131' 'HI',
> > > > > > > > > + '-0.228*J+UI*131+TR' 'HI', '0.606*J+UI*132' 'HI',
> > > > > > > > > + '0.606*J+UI*132+TR' 'HI', '-0.002*J+UI*133' 'HI',
> > > > > > > > > + '-0.002*J+UI*133+TR' 'LO', '0.385*J+UI*134' 'LO',
> > > > > > > > > + '0.385*J+UI*134+TR' 'HI', '0.012*J+UI*135' 'HI',
> > > > > > > > > + '0.012*J+UI*135+TR' 'LO', '0.14*J+UI*136' 'LO',
> > > > > > > > > + '0.14*J+UI*136+TR' 'LO', '-0.286*J+UI*137' 'LO',
> > > > > > > > > + '-0.286*J+UI*137+TR' 'HI', '-0.124*J+UI*138' 'HI',
> > > > > > > > > + '-0.124*J+UI*138+TR' 'HI', '0.132*J+UI*139' 'HI',
> > > > > > > > > + '0.132*J+UI*139+TR' 'HI', '0.65*J+UI*140' 'HI',
> > > > > > > > > + '0.65*J+UI*140+TR' 'LO', '0.422*J+UI*141' 'LO',
> > > > > > > > > + '0.422*J+UI*141+TR' 'HI', '-0.173*J+UI*142' 'HI',
> > > > > > > > > + '-0.173*J+UI*142+TR' 'HI', '-0.701*J+UI*143' 'HI',
> > > > > > > > > + '-0.701*J+UI*143+TR' 'HI', '0.674*J+UI*144' 'HI',
> > > > > > > > > + '0.674*J+UI*144+TR' 'LO', '-0.063*J+UI*145' 'LO',
> > > > > > > > > + '-0.063*J+UI*145+TR' 'LO', '0.697*J+UI*146' 'LO',
> > > > > > > > > + '0.697*J+UI*146+TR' 'HI', '-0.464*J+UI*147' 'HI',
> > > > > > > > > + '-0.464*J+UI*147+TR' 'HI', '0.241*J+UI*148' 'HI',
> > > > > > > > > + '0.241*J+UI*148+TR' 'LO', '0.158*J+UI*149' 'LO',
> > > > > > > > > + '0.158*J+UI*149+TR' 'HI', '0.725*J+UI*150' 'HI',
> > > > > > > > > + '0.725*J+UI*150+TR' 'LO', '-0.715*J+UI*151' 'LO',
> > > > > > > > > + '-0.715*J+UI*151+TR' 'HI', '0.379*J+UI*152' 'HI',
> > > > > > > > > + '0.379*J+UI*152+TR' 'HI', '-0.341*J+UI*153' 'HI',
> > > > > > > > > + '-0.341*J+UI*153+TR' 'LO', '0.387*J+UI*154' 'LO',
> > > > > > > > > + '0.387*J+UI*154+TR' 'HI', '-0.158*J+UI*155' 'HI',
> > > > > > > > > + '-0.158*J+UI*155+TR' 'LO', '0.637*J+UI*156' 'LO',
> > > > > > > > > + '0.637*J+UI*156+TR' 'LO', '-0.883*J+UI*157' 'LO',
> > > > > > > > > + '-0.883*J+UI*157+TR' 'LO', '-0.083*J+UI*158' 'LO',
> > > > > > > > > + '-0.083*J+UI*158+TR' 'HI', '-0.087*J+UI*159' 'HI',
> > > > > > > > > + '-0.087*J+UI*159+TR' 'HI', '0.573*J+UI*160' 'HI',
> > > > > > > > > .ends
> > > > > > > > >=3D20
> > > > > > > > >=3D20
> > > > > > > > >=3D20
> > > > > > > > >=3D20
> > > > > > > > >=3D20
> > > > > > > > > On Feb 15, "Chris Cheng" <Chris.Cheng@xxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > May be its just me but Rj only makes sense when you are
> > > > trying to =
> > > > > > > =3D
> > > > > > > > extract a BERT=3D20
> > > > > > > > curve
> > > > > > > > > which seems to be a MATLAB job.
> > > > > > > > > > If you have your Tx Rj, channel model and jitter
> > > > transfer of your =
> > > > > > > =3D
> > > > > > > > CDR, the rest of=3D20
> > > > > > > > the
> > > > > > > > > work is straight forward.
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > At 10:40 AM 2/7/2006 -0800, Ali Burney wrote:
> > > > > > > > > > >=3D20
> > > > > > > > > > >> Hi,
> > > > > > > > > > >>
> > > > > > > > > > >>
> > > > > > > > > > >> I am running gigabit Ethernet link simulation using
> > > > HSPICE and =
> > > > > > > =3D
> > > > > > > > have a=3D3D20
> > > > > > > > > > >> question on adding jitter to the transmitted data.
> > > > Is there any =
> > > > > > > =3D
> > > > > > > > way to=3D3D20
> > > > > > > > > > >> add Gaussian jitter to the transmitted data? I know
> > > > that tools =
> > > > > > > =3D
> > > > > > > > such as
> > > > > > > > > > >> =3D20
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > >=3D20
> > > > > > > > > > >> Hyperlynx allow you to add transmit jitter.
> > > > > > > > > > >>
> > > > > > > > > > >>
> > > > > > > > > > >>
> > > > > > > > > > >> Thanks and best regards,
> > > > > > > > > > >>
> > > > > > > > > > >>
> > > > > > > > > > >>
> > > > > > > > > > >> A Burney
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > >------------------------------------------------------------------
> > > > > >To unsubscribe from si-list:
> > > > > >si-list-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx with 'unsubscribe' in the Subject field
> > > > > >
> > > > > >or to administer your membership from a web page, go to:
> > > > > ><a href='<a
> > href='<a href='//www.freelists.org/webpage/si-'><a
href='//www.freelists.org/webpage/si-</a>'>//www.freelists.org/webpage/si-
</a></a>'>//www.freelists.org/webpage/si-'><a
href='//www.freelists.org/webpage/si-</a>'>//www.freelists.org/webpage/si-
</a></a></a>
> > > >list'><a href='<a href='//www.freelists.org/webpage/si-
'>//www.freelists.org/webpage/si-</a>
> >list</a>'><a href='//www.freelists.org/webpage/si-
list</a></a>'>//www.freelists.org/webpage/si-list</a></a></a>
> > > > > >
> > > > > >For help:
> > > > > >si-list-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx with 'help' in the Subject field
> > > > > >
> > > > > >List FAQ wiki page is located at:
> > > > > > <a
> > > > href='<a href='<a href='http://si-list.org/wiki/wiki.pl?Si-
List_FAQ'><a'>http://si-list.org/wiki/wiki.pl?Si-List_FAQ'><a</a>
> > href='<a href='http://si-
> >list.org/wiki/wiki.pl?Si-List_FAQ</a>'><a
> >href='http://si->list.org/wiki/wiki.pl?Si-
'>http://si->list.org/wiki/wiki.pl?Si-</a>'>http://si-
> >list.org/wiki/wiki.pl?Si-List_FAQ</a>'><a
> >href='http://si->list.org/wiki/wiki.pl?Si-
'>http://si->list.org/wiki/wiki.pl?Si-</a></a>
> > >list.org/wiki/wiki.pl?Si-List_FAQ</a>'><a
> > >href='http://si->list.org/wiki/wiki.pl?Si-
'>http://si->list.org/wiki/wiki.pl?Si-</a>
> >List_FAQ</a></a>'><a
> >href='http://si-list.org/wiki/wiki.pl?Si-List_FAQ'><a'>http://si-
list.org/wiki/wiki.pl?Si-List_FAQ'><a</a>
> >href='<a href='http://si-
> >list.org/wiki/wiki.pl?Si-List_FAQ</a>'><a
> >href='http://si->list.org/wiki/wiki.pl?Si-
'>http://si->list.org/wiki/wiki.pl?Si-</a>'>http://si-
> >list.org/wiki/wiki.pl?Si-List_FAQ</a>'><a
> >href='http://si->list.org/wiki/wiki.pl?Si-
'>http://si->list.org/wiki/wiki.pl?Si-</a></a>
> > >list.org/wiki/wiki.pl?Si-List_FAQ</a>'><a
> > >href='http://si->list.org/wiki/wiki.pl?Si-
'>http://si->list.org/wiki/wiki.pl?Si-</a>
> >List_FAQ</a></a></a>
> > > >list.org/wiki/wiki.pl?Si-List_FAQ</a>
> > > > > >
> > > > > >List technical documents are available at:
> > > > > > <a
> > > > href='<a href='<a href='http://www.si-list.org'><a'>http://www.si-
list.org'><a</a> href='<a href='http://www.si-'>http://www.si-</a>
> >list.org</a>'><a href='http://www.si-list.org</a></a>'><a
> >href='http://www.si-
list.org'><a'>http://www.si-list.org'><a</a>'>http://www.si-list.org</a></a>'><a
href='http://www.si-list.org'><a'>http://www.si-list.org'><a</a></a>
> >href='<a href='http://www.si-list.org</a>'><a href='http://www.si-
list.org</a></a></a>'>http://www.si-list.org</a></a></a></a>'>http://www.si-
list.org</a>'><a href='http://www.si-list.org</a></a></a>'>http://www.si-
list.org</a></a></a></a></a>
> > > > > >
> > > > > >List archives are viewable at:
> > > > > > <a href='<a
> > href='<a href='//www.freelists.org/archives/si-'><a
href='//www.freelists.org/archives/si-</a>'>//www.freelists.org/archives/si-
</a></a>'>//www.freelists.org/archives/si-'><a
href='//www.freelists.org/archives/si-</a>'>//www.freelists.org/archives/si-
</a></a></a>
> > > >list'><a href='<a href='//www.freelists.org/archives/si-
'>//www.freelists.org/archives/si-</a>
> >list</a>'><a href='//www.freelists.org/archives/si-
list</a></a>'>//www.freelists.org/archives/si-list</a></a></a>
> > > > > >or at our remote archives:
> > > > > > <a href='<a
> > href='<a href='http://groups.yahoo.com/group/si-'><a
href='http://groups.yahoo.com/group/si-</a>'>http://groups.yahoo.com/group/si-
</a></a>'>http://groups.yahoo.com/group/si-'><a
href='http://groups.yahoo.com/group/si-
</a>'>http://groups.yahoo.com/group/si-</a></a></a>
> > > >list/messages'><a href='<a href='http://groups.yahoo.com/group/si-
'>http://groups.yahoo.com/group/si-</a>
> >list/messages</a>'><a href='http://groups.yahoo.com/group/si-
list/messages</a></a>'>http://groups.yahoo.com/group/si-list/messages</a></a></a>
> > > > > >Old (prior to June 6, 2001) list archives are viewable at:
> > > > > > <a
> > > > href='<a href='<a
href='http://www.qsl.net/wb6tpu'><a'>http://www.qsl.net/wb6tpu'><a</a>
> >href='<a href='http://www.qsl.net/wb6tpu</a>'><a
href='http://www.qsl.net/wb6tpu</a></a>'><a
href='http://www.qsl.ne'>http://www.qsl.ne</a>'>http://www.qsl.net/wb6tpu</a></a>'><a
href='http://www.qsl.ne'>http://www.qsl.ne</a></a>'>http://www.qsl.net/wb6tpu</a>'><a
href='http://www.qsl.net/wb6tpu</a></a>'><a
href='http://www.qsl.ne'>http://www.qsl.ne</a>'>http://www.qsl.net/wb6tpu</a></a>'><a
href='http://www.qsl.ne'>http://www.qsl.ne</a></a></a>
> >t/wb6tpu'><a
> >href='<a href='http://www.qsl.net/wb6tpu</a>'><a
href='http://www.qsl.net/wb6tpu</a></a></a>'>http://www.qsl.net/wb6tpu</a></a></a></a>'>h
ttp://www.qsl.net/wb6tpu</a>'><a
href='http://www.qsl.net/wb6tpu</a></a></a>'>http://www.qsl.net/wb6tpu</a></a></a></a></a
>
> > > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------
> > > > > To unsubscribe from si-list:
> > > > > si-list-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx with 'unsubscribe' in the Subject field
> > > > >
> > > > > or to administer your membership from a web page, go to:
> > > > > <a
> > > > href='<a href='<a href='//www.freelists.org/webpage/si-
list'><a'>//www.freelists.org/webpage/si-list'><a</a>
> >href='<a href='//www.freelists.org/webpage/si-'><a
href='//www.freelists.org/webpage/si-'>//www.freelists.org/webpage/si-
</a>'>//www.freelists.org/webpage/si-'><a
href='//www.freelists.org/webpage/si-
'>//www.freelists.org/webpage/si-</a></a>
> ></a>'><a href='//www.freelists.org/webpage/si-
list'><a'>//www.freelists.org/webpage/si-list'><a</a>
> >href='<a href='//www.freelists.org/webpage/si-'><a
href='//www.freelists.org/webpage/si-</a></a>'>//www.freelists.org/webpage/si-
</a></a></a>'>//www.freelists.org/webpage/si-'><a
href='//www.freelists.org/webpage/si-</a></a>'>//www.freelists.org/webpage/si-
</a></a></a></a>
> > > >list</a>
> > > > >
> > > > > For help:
> > > > > si-list-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx with 'help' in the Subject field
> > > > >
> > > > > List FAQ wiki page is located at:
> > > > > <a
> > > > href='<a href='<a href='http://si-list.org/wiki/wiki.pl?Si-
List_FAQ'><a'>http://si-list.org/wiki/wiki.pl?Si-List_FAQ'><a</a>
> > href='<a href='http://si-
> >list.org/wiki/wiki.pl?Si-List_FAQ</a>'><a
> >href='http://si->list.org/wiki/wiki.pl?Si-
'>http://si->list.org/wiki/wiki.pl?Si-</a>'>http://si-
> >list.org/wiki/wiki.pl?Si-List_FAQ</a>'><a
> >href='http://si->list.org/wiki/wiki.pl?Si-
'>http://si->list.org/wiki/wiki.pl?Si-</a></a>
> > >list.org/wiki/wiki.pl?Si-List_FAQ</a>'><a
> > >href='http://si->list.org/wiki/wiki.pl?Si-
'>http://si->list.org/wiki/wiki.pl?Si-</a>
> >List_FAQ</a></a>'><a
> >href='http://si-list.org/wiki/wiki.pl?Si-List_FAQ'><a'>http://si-
list.org/wiki/wiki.pl?Si-List_FAQ'><a</a>
> >href='<a href='http://si-
> >list.org/wiki/wiki.pl?Si-List_FAQ</a>'><a
> >href='http://si->list.org/wiki/wiki.pl?Si-
'>http://si->list.org/wiki/wiki.pl?Si-</a>'>http://si-
> >list.org/wiki/wiki.pl?Si-List_FAQ</a>'><a
> >href='http://si->list.org/wiki/wiki.pl?Si-
'>http://si->list.org/wiki/wiki.pl?Si-</a></a>
> > >list.org/wiki/wiki.pl?Si-List_FAQ</a>'><a
> > >href='http://si->list.org/wiki/wiki.pl?Si-
'>http://si->list.org/wiki/wiki.pl?Si-</a>
> >List_FAQ</a></a></a>
> > > >list.org/wiki/wiki.pl?Si-List_FAQ</a>
> > > > >
> > > > > List technical documents are available at:
> > > > > <a href='<a href='<a href='http://www.si-
list.org'><a'>http://www.si-list.org'><a</a>
> > href='<a href='http://www.si-'>http://www.si-</a>
> >list.org</a>'><a href='http://www.si-list.org</a></a>'><a
> >href='http://www.si-
list.org'><a'>http://www.si-list.org'><a</a>'>http://www.si-list.org</a></a>'><a
href='http://www.si-list.org'><a'>http://www.si-list.org'><a</a></a>
> >href='<a href='http://www.si-list.org</a>'><a href='http://www.si-
list.org</a></a></a>'>http://www.si-list.org</a></a></a></a>'>http://www.si-
list.org</a>'><a href='http://www.si-list.org</a></a></a>'>http://www.si-
list.org</a></a></a></a></a>
> > > > >
> > > > > List archives are viewable at:
> > > > > <a href='<a
> > href='<a href='//www.freelists.org/archives/si-'><a
href='//www.freelists.org/archives/si-</a>'>//www.freelists.org/archives/si-
</a></a>'>//www.freelists.org/archives/si-'><a
href='//www.freelists.org/archives/si-</a>'>//www.freelists.org/archives/si-
</a></a></a>
> > > >list'><a href='<a href='//www.freelists.org/archives/si-
'>//www.freelists.org/archives/si-</a>
> >list</a>'><a href='//www.freelists.org/archives/si-
list</a></a>'>//www.freelists.org/archives/si-list</a></a></a>
> > > > > or at our remote archives:
> > > > > <a href='<a
> > href='<a href='http://groups.yahoo.com/group/si-'><a
href='http://groups.yahoo.com/group/si-</a>'>http://groups.yahoo.com/group/si-
</a></a>'>http://groups.yahoo.com/group/si-'><a
href='http://groups.yahoo.com/group/si-
</a>'>http://groups.yahoo.com/group/si-</a></a></a>
> > > >list/messages'><a href='<a href='http://groups.yahoo.com/group/si-
'>http://groups.yahoo.com/group/si-</a>
> >list/messages</a>'><a href='http://groups.yahoo.com/group/si-
list/messages</a></a>'>http://groups.yahoo.com/group/si-list/messages</a></a></a>
> > > > > Old (prior to June 6, 2001) list archives are viewable at:
> > > > > <a
> > > > href='<a href='<a
href='http://www.qsl.net/wb6tpu'><a'>http://www.qsl.net/wb6tpu'><a</a>
> >href='<a href='http://www.qsl.net/wb6tpu</a>'><a
href='http://www.qsl.net/wb6tpu</a></a>'><a
href='http://www.qsl.ne'>http://www.qsl.ne</a>'>http://www.qsl.net/wb6tpu</a></a>'><a
href='http://www.qsl.ne'>http://www.qsl.ne</a></a>'>http://www.qsl.net/wb6tpu</a>'><a
href='http://www.qsl.net/wb6tpu</a></a>'><a
href='http://www.qsl.ne'>http://www.qsl.ne</a>'>http://www.qsl.net/wb6tpu</a></a>'><a
href='http://www.qsl.ne'>http://www.qsl.ne</a></a></a>
> >t/wb6tpu'><a
> >href='<a href='http://www.qsl.net/wb6tpu</a>'><a
href='http://www.qsl.net/wb6tpu</a></a></a>'>http://www.qsl.net/wb6tpu</a></a></a></a>'>h
ttp://www.qsl.net/wb6tpu</a>'><a
href='http://www.qsl.net/wb6tpu</a></a></a>'>http://www.qsl.net/wb6tpu</a></a></a></a></a
>
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > >------------------------------------------------------------------
> > > >To unsubscribe from si-list:
> > > >si-list-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx with 'unsubscribe' in the Subject field
> > > >
> > > >or to administer your membership from a web page, go to:
> > > ><a href='<a href='//www.freelists.org/webpage/si-
'>//www.freelists.org/webpage/si-</a>
> >list'><a href='//www.freelists.org/webpage/si-
list</a>'>//www.freelists.org/webpage/si-list</a></a>
> > > >
> > > >For help:
> > > >si-list-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx with 'help' in the Subject field
> > > >
> > > >List FAQ wiki page is located at:
> > > > <a
> > href='<a href='http://si-list.org/wiki/wiki.pl?Si-List_FAQ'><a
> > href='http://si-
>list.org/wiki/wiki.pl?Si-List_FAQ</a>'>http://si->list.org/wiki/wiki.pl?Si-
List_FAQ</a></a>'>http://si-list.org/wiki/wiki.pl?Si-List_FAQ'><a
href='http://si-
>list.org/wiki/wiki.pl?Si-List_FAQ</a>'>http://si->list.org/wiki/wiki.pl?Si-
List_FAQ</a></a></a>
> >list.org/wiki/wiki.pl?Si-List_FAQ</a>
> > > >
> > > >List technical documents are available at:
> > > > <a
> > href='<a href='http://www.si-list.org'><a href='http://www.si-
list.org</a>'>http://www.si-list.org</a></a>'>http://www.si-list.org'><a
href='http://www.si-list.org</a>'>http://www.si-list.org</a></a></a>
> > > >
> > > >List archives are viewable at:
> > > > <a
> >href='<a href='//www.freelists.org/archi'><a
href='//www.freelists.org/archi</a>ves/si-
list'>//www.freelists.org/archi</a>ves/si-
list</a>'>//www.freelists.org/archi'><a
href='//www.freelists.org/archi</a>ves/si-
list'>//www.freelists.org/archi</a>ves/si-list</a></a>
> > > >or at our remote archives:
> > > > <a href='<a href='http://groups.yahoo.com/group/si-
'>http://groups.yahoo.com/group/si-</a>
> >list/messages'><a href='http://groups.yahoo.com/group/si-
list/messages</a>'>http://groups.yahoo.com/group/si-list/messages</a></a>
> > > >Old (prior to June 6, 2001) list archives are viewable at:
> > > > <a
> > href='<a href='http://www.qsl.net/wb6tpu'><a
href='http://www.qsl.net/wb6tpu</a>'>http://www.qsl.net/wb6tpu</a></a>'>http://www.qsl.ne
t/wb6tpu'><a
href='http://www.qsl.net/wb6tpu</a>'>http://www.qsl.net/wb6tpu</a></a></a>
> > > >
> > >
> > > ------------------------------------------------------------------
> > > To unsubscribe from si-list:
> > > si-list-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx with 'unsubscribe' in the Subject field
> > >
> > > or to administer your membership from a web page, go to:
> > > <a
> > href='<a href='//www.freelists.org/webpage/si-list'><a
href='//www.freelists.org/webpage/si-'>//www.freelists.org/webpage/si-
</a>'>//www.freelists.org/webpage/si-list'><a
href='//www.freelists.org/webpage/si-'>//www.freelists.org/webpage/si-</a></a>
> >list</a>
> > >
> > > For help:
> > > si-list-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx with 'help' in the Subject field
> > >
> > > List FAQ wiki page is located at:
> > > <a
> > href='<a href='http://si-list.org/wiki/wiki.pl?Si-List_FAQ'><a
> > href='http://si-
>list.org/wiki/wiki.pl?Si-List_FAQ</a>'>http://si->list.org/wiki/wiki.pl?Si-
List_FAQ</a></a>'>http://si-list.org/wiki/wiki.pl?Si-List_FAQ'><a
href='http://si-
>list.org/wiki/wiki.pl?Si-List_FAQ</a>'>http://si->list.org/wiki/wiki.pl?Si-
List_FAQ</a></a></a>
> >list.org/wiki/wiki.pl?Si-List_FAQ</a>
> > >
> > > List technical documents are available at:
> > > <a href='<a href='http://www.si-list.org'><a
> > > href='http://www.si-
list.org</a>'>http://www.si-list.org</a></a>'>http://www.si-list.org'><a
href='http://www.si-list.org</a>'>http://www.si-list.org</a></a></a>
> > >
> > > List archives are viewable at:
> > > <a href='<a href='//www.freelists.org/archives/si-
'>//www.freelists.org/archives/si-</a>
> >list'><a href='//www.freelists.org/archives/si-
list</a>'>//www.freelists.org/archives/si-list</a></a>
> > > or at our remote archives:
> > > <a href='<a href='http://groups.yahoo.com/group/si-
'>http://groups.yahoo.com/group/si-</a>
> >list/messages'><a href='http://groups.yahoo.com/group/si-
list/messages</a>'>http://groups.yahoo.com/group/si-list/messages</a></a>
> > > Old (prior to June 6, 2001) list archives are viewable at:
> > > <a
> > href='<a href='http://www.qsl.net/wb6tpu'><a
href='http://www.qsl.net/wb6tpu</a>'>http://www.qsl.net/wb6tpu</a></a>'>http://www.qsl.ne
t/wb6tpu'><a
href='http://www.qsl.net/wb6tpu</a>'>http://www.qsl.net/wb6tpu</a></a></a>
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >------------------------------------------------------------------
> >To unsubscribe from si-list:
> >si-list-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx with 'unsubscribe' in the Subject field
> >
> >or to administer your membership from a web page, go to:
> ><a href='//www.freelists.org/webpage/si-
list'>//www.freelists.org/webpage/si-list</a>
> >
> >For help:
> >si-list-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx with 'help' in the Subject field
> >
> >List FAQ wiki page is located at:
> > <a href='http://si-list.org/wiki/wi'>http://si-
list.org/wiki/wi</a>ki.pl?Si-List_FAQ
> >
> >List technical documents are available at:
> > <a href='http://www.si-list.org'>http://www.si-list.org</a>
> >
> >List archives are viewable at:
> > <a href='//www.freelists.org/archives/si-
list'>//www.freelists.org/archives/si-list</a>
> >or at our remote archives:
> > <a href='http://groups.yahoo.com/group/si-
list/messages'>http://groups.yahoo.com/group/si-list/messages</a>
> >Old (prior to June 6, 2001) list archives are viewable at:
> > <a
> > href='http://www.qsl.net/wb6tpu'>http://www.qsl.net/wb6tpu</a>
> >
>
>
------------------------------------------------------------------
To unsubscribe from si-list:
si-list-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx with 'unsubscribe' in the Subject field
or to administer your membership from a web page, go to:
//www.freelists.org/webpage/si-list
For help:
si-list-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx with 'help' in the Subject field
List FAQ wiki page is located at:
http://si-list.org/wiki/wiki.pl?Si-List_FAQ
List technical documents are available at:
http://www.si-list.org
List archives are viewable at:
//www.freelists.org/archives/si-list
or at our remote archives:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/si-list/messages
Old (prior to June 6, 2001) list archives are viewable at:
http://www.qsl.net/wb6tpu
Other related posts:
