[SI-LIST] Re: Copper width that has DCR within target spec
- From: Feng Wu <wufengthu@xxxxxxxxx>
- To: Cristian Gozzi <cristian.gozzi@xxxxxxxxx>
- Date: Mon, 30 Sep 2013 14:15:48 +0800
Hi Cristian
Yes. The tool will automatically extract DC by DC solver and AC by AC
solver to form a complete S parameter.
however after the merging/fitting, the causality sometimes fail. We have
fixed it for transient simulation.
B.R.
Feng Wu (Îâ·ã)
-------------
Signal Integrity Engineer
Cisco Shanghai
-------------
2013/9/30 Cristian Gozzi <cristian.gozzi@xxxxxxxxx>
> Hi folks
>
> Just to remark that nowdays the full wave tools I well know (SIwave and
> PowerSI) are capable to extract S - parameters and ancor DC point to their
> embedded DC solver...
> (DC Resistance FEM solver)
>
> So no dc extrapolation any more, but an accurate model from DC up to the
> highest frequency for an accurate PDN analysis.
>
> Regards
>
> Cristian
> Chip - Package - Board
> Staff Engineer
> Infineon Technologies AG
> Il giorno 30/set/2013 07:15, "Feng Wu" <wufengthu@xxxxxxxxx> ha scritto:
>
>> Hi Novak
>> I agree. I also mentioned it in the previous mail.
>> There is not such a formular in hand. We need to use the dedicated DC
>> solver.
>> Thanks
>> --
>> B.R.
>> Feng Wu (Îâ·ã)
>> -------------
>> Signal Integrity Engineer
>> Cisco Shanghai
>> -------------
>>
>>
>> 2013/9/30 Istvan Novak <istvan.novak@xxxxxxxxxxx>
>>
>> > Hi Feng,
>> >
>> > What you say is all true, but unfortunately getting a reasonable
>> estimate
>> > for DC resistance by hand calculations under realistic (complex)
>> geometries
>> > is not possible. Even at DC the current density has a two (or three, in
>> > multi-layer plane structures) dimensional distribution, so you need a
>> tool
>> > to mesh the structure and calculate the DC resistance.
>> >
>> > Regards,
>> >
>> > Istvan NovakOracle
>> >
>> >
>> > On 9/28/2013 2:08 AM, Feng Wu wrote:
>> >
>> >> Hi Mark
>> >> It is definitely true, we need to consider impedance from AC point of
>> >> view.
>> >> However I would like to check/design the DC performance at beginning
>> >> before
>> >> checking/designing AC performance. In practice this is proved to be
>> more
>> >> effiecient way. There are lots of reason. One of the most important is,
>> >> although the DC point of Z is R, yet we can't obtain all the DC
>> >> information
>> >> accurately, sufficiently and efficiently by AC simulation tool.
>> >>
>> >> Thanks
>> >> Feng
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >
>>
>>
>> --
>>
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