Helen, It is so funny that I happened to be playing around with some math regarding the standard when you sent this Email. I agree on your length assessment, particularly when looking at the loin. Here are the numbers I came up with based on Geometry and the 8 1/2 to 10 ratio and the recommended height range for males and females. Get out your measuring tapes. I know I have ;-) Thoughts? Dog's Bitches Height 24 - 26 Inches 22 - 24 Inches Body Depth(at Whither) 13.2 - 14.3 Inches 12.1 - 13.2 Inches Shoulder 7.6 - 8.3 Inches 7 - 7.6 Inches Upper Arm 7.6 - 8.3 Inches 7 - 7.6 Inches Leg/Pastern(Floor to the elbow) 13.2 - 14.3 Inches 12.1 - 13.2 Inches Length 28.2 - 30.6 Inches 25.9 - 28.2 Inches ============================================================================ POST is Copyrighted 2006. All material remains the property of the original author and of GSD Communication, Inc. NO REPRODUCTIONS or FORWARDS of any kind are permitted without prior permission of the original author AND of the Showgsd-l Management. ALL RIGHTS RESERVED. ALL PERSONS ARE ON NOTICE THAT THE FORWARDING, REPRODUCTION OR USE IN ANY MANNER OF ANY MATERIAL WHICH APPEARS ON SHOWGSD-L WITHOUT THE EXPRESS PERMISSION OF ALL PARTIES TO THE POST AND THE LIST MANAGEMENT IS EXPRESSLY FORBIDDEN, AND IS A VIOLATION OF LAW. VIOLATORS OF THIS PROHIBITION WILL BE PROSECUTED. For assistance, please contact the List Management at admin@xxxxxxxxxxxx VISIT OUR WEBSITE - URL temporarily deleted due to AOL issues ============================================================================