If you think about it the only reason GV Troll was sold here was the light pigment he threw among other things. That's a whole other story. The "F" litter Arbywood were very light. We already had a lot of light dogs in the lines popular here. So we reap what we sow and went on to better pigment and gained more but different problems.At least now we can breed without the restrictions of the size of the country. If we would all be more honest we could make better decisions. Joan Joan F. Fox17500 Haskins Rd.Chagrin Falls, Ohio 44023tel: 440-759-4119http://www.campaignersgsds.com On Tuesday, January 20, 2015 5:27 PM, Carolyn Martello <marhaven@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote: #yiv4937848079 #yiv4937848079 -- _filtered #yiv4937848079 {font-family:Helvetica;panose-1:2 11 6 4 2 2 2 2 2 4;} _filtered #yiv4937848079 {panose-1:2 4 5 3 5 4 6 3 2 4;} _filtered #yiv4937848079 {font-family:Calibri;panose-1:2 15 5 2 2 2 4 3 2 4;}#yiv4937848079 #yiv4937848079 p.yiv4937848079MsoNormal, #yiv4937848079 li.yiv4937848079MsoNormal, #yiv4937848079 div.yiv4937848079MsoNormal {margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt;font-size:12.0pt;}#yiv4937848079 a:link, #yiv4937848079 span.yiv4937848079MsoHyperlink {color:blue;text-decoration:underline;}#yiv4937848079 a:visited, #yiv4937848079 span.yiv4937848079MsoHyperlinkFollowed {color:purple;text-decoration:underline;}#yiv4937848079 span.yiv4937848079EmailStyle17 {color:#1F497D;}#yiv4937848079 .yiv4937848079MsoChpDefault {} _filtered #yiv4937848079 {margin:1.0in 1.0in 1.0in 1.0in;}#yiv4937848079 div.yiv4937848079WordSection1 {}#yiv4937848079 I don't think we would change our breeding program....but we definitely wouldhave to raise the dogs differently in their behavior and do a lot more intense andcomplicated training. Evan is right about the CH. Asgard's Big Deal...."brother to Big Ben" ....he was one ofthe most GORGEOUS DARK sables ever!! EVER! <G> A black/ red sable color....withlots of plush coat and bone and a beautiful male head! GORGEOUS dog. Carolyn marhaven@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx ......Were I not in conformation, or decided to go for a working dog,in reality, not just in classification, I would probably change mybreeding program. It is not better or worse, just different. Evan -----Original Message----- From: edwinx <edwinx@xxxxxxxxxxx> To: freelist <showgsd-l@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> Sent: Tue, Jan 20, 2015 10:54 am Subject: [ SHOWGSD-L ] question: Black and RedThis is NOT a German VS American question so please don't misunderstand the question! It seems that the majority of German working style GSDs are black/red...and the majority of American/Canadian conformation style GSDs are NOT black/red. Yes I know all strong colors, except the disqualifying ones, are permissible... I like black and red! My half German bitch is black red...just wondering why it seems not to pop up very often in most of our "show" dogs Ed Sent from Xfinity Connect Mobile App