Could have been so simple to just make it into one clear and concise DQ so I kind of doubt 'not wanting more or too many DQ's' was the motivation. ie. All whites and dilutes without black noses. DQ. Carolyn marhaven@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx www.marhaven.com -----Original Message----- From: On Behalf Of Sheree Moses Subject: Ballots and Noses I haven't seen a ballot yet, have to go to the post office, but just want to throw this out there.I have seen (in a variety of places) comments regarding blues/livers, etc that imply the possible standard change will make them more acceptable. Again, I have not seen the ballot yet, but I don't believe there would be any change regarding dilutes whatsoever. They remain a serious fault. It is a question of a contradiction in our standard regarding dilutes and nose color.I have been assisting w/educational seminars since 1992, and have conducted them on my own for several years now....and invariably, at every seminar, at least one all-breed judge asks me, "Okay, which is it??" and initially I asked what they meant (now I see it coming:).Our standard describes blues/livers as a serious fault, yet says that a nose not predominately black is a DQ.This makes us look like dummies who really don't understand color inheritance in dogs. (Okay, maybe we don't) Blue dogs have gray no ses, liver dogs have brown noses (or, dilutes have self-colored noses, if you want to be technical). So, should our standard change have proposed that we make blues/livers a DQ? Or that a nose not predominately black be a serious fault? We should do one or the other, and I guess the powers that be decided we didn't need another DQ. I wasn't in charge of the revision, or I might have borrowed from a couple of other standards, who don't want more DQs but try to make the point and added the line "shall be penalized so severely as to remove the dog from further competition." Oh well, would have, should have.Anyway, that's the point behind the nose color issue. We need to do something so our standard doesn't look stupid. If the nose color doesn't pass, we should probably take some sort of poll and see if people want dilutes to be a DQ, too. Somebody want to be in charge of that? Going out to scoop my dogs Sheree PS. I, personally, can't stand noses that aren't BLA CK, and that includes "snow noses." ============================================================================ POST is Copyrighted 2014. All material remains the property of the original author and of GSD Communication, Inc. NO REPRODUCTIONS or FORWARDS of any kind are permitted without prior permission of the original author AND of the Showgsd-l Management. ALL RIGHTS RESERVED. Each Author is responsible for the content of his/her post. This group and its administrators are not responsible for the comments or opinions expressed in any post. ALL PERSONS ARE ON NOTICE THAT THE FORWARDING, REPRODUCTION OR USE IN ANY MANNER OF ANY MATERIAL WHICH APPEARS ON SHOWGSD-L WITHOUT THE EXPRESS PERMISSION OF ALL PARTIES TO THE POST AND THE LIST MANAGEMENT IS EXPRESSLY FORBIDDEN, AND IS A VIOLATION OF LAW. VIOLATORS OF THIS PROHIBITION WILL BE PROSECUTED. For assistance, please contact the List Management at admin@xxxxxxxxxxx VISIT OUR WEBSITE - http://showgsd.org SUBSCRIPTION: http://showgsd.org/mail.html NATIONAL BLOG - http://gsdnational.blogspot.com/ ============================================================================