Thomas; I agree completely and I hope with all my heart that all of this comes to nothing. Jeff, I know the nice person that you are. I have set up next to you at public events and watched you enjoy showing the sky to eager children, I have watched you at the ATM meeting helping another club member with a project. I listened to your presentation to the club and learned about taking photometric readings of the sky. I hope you will see that taking out your frustrations on SAC will not yield the result you want. Please, either stop attends SAC gatherings or just don't attend the Messier Marathon and enjoy the rest of what we have to offer. Continuing to think that after a vote of 24 to 3 we are gong to do anything different about this issue is not the way life in SAC is going to be. Steve Coe -----Original Message----- From: sac-forum-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:sac-forum-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Stars Sent: Saturday, September 17, 2005 1:10 PM To: sac-forum@xxxxxxxxxxxxx Subject: [sac-forum] Re: The good news, SAC returns to astronomy Steve, I am new this club, this being my first year. We got outvoted, That is a fact. I don't feel that any board member or AJ or any-one of the club members have any mal intent to do harm to any of us. Every one of them have a good heart, try to teach there fellows astronomers, and make this a fun thing to do. Please let's drop this and get back to astronomy, and don't hold hard feeling because we were on the losing side of the vote. Lets be on the winning side of astronomy and this hobby. Sincerely Thomas Hilton -----Original Message----- From: sac-forum-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:sac-forum-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Jeff Hopkins Sent: 09/17/2005 9:47 AM To: sac-forum@xxxxxxxxxxxxx Subject: [sac-forum] Re: The good news, SAC returns to astronomy A sad day for SAC! Do the SAC members really believe star parties are dangerous and thus require waivers? To me star parties are no more dangerous than life itself. I feel SAC is shrinking from responsibility by requiring waivers and is very childlike. What is also sad is I did not see even one good reason for the waivers. The key now seems to be not to be a SAC member and then when attending SAC events just retain your rights and do not sign any waiver. Since there is nothing SAC can do if you are not a member that would seem to be the best approach. I'm sure this will come back to bite SAC. I used to have respect for SAC. Jeff At 02:32 -0700 9/17/05, Steve Coe wrote: Well, the vote has been taken and the Saguaro Astronomy Club has decided to amend the constitution so that a waiver can be put in place for the Messier Marathon. I am happy that both sides got to say what they wanted and that the vote was finally taken. So, as I said earlier, let's get back to astronomy. I think we have beat this horse far too often and I think that SAC needs to return to what it does best-set up some telescopes and look at the sky. Looking forward to Cherry Road for next Saturday night; Steve Coe -- Jeff Hopkins HPO SOFT http://www.hposoft.com/Astro/astro.html Hopkins Phoenix Observatory 7812 West Clayton Drive Phoenix, Arizona 85033-2439 U.S.A. www.hposoft.com