At 10:28 PM 4/21/05 +0000, jon.stanton@xxxxxxxxxxx wrote: >Just a thought....Maybe Ruben should define "Liberal" government. The European (Classical) definition is almost directly opposite of the U.S. definition. Hayek's "Road to Serfdom" is a good source. This is a grand point but not totally accurate: most US "philosophical conservatives" adopt the term "libertarian" as a connection to the= tradition. The problem arose when the British and European Liberals became so enamoured of expanding the franchise that they forgot their dedication to personal liberty. That left the traditional Right, who had long advocated a dedication to personal liberty but were also committed to a limited franchise, in control of the personal liberty thing, and they have owned it since 1875 in Europe and the US. You want a Big Government allowing Social Workers into your home to check your plumbing, vote Democrat. You want a Big Government allowing Pastors into your home to check your reading materail, vote Republican. You want a Small Government allowing one-half Social Workers into your home to see if your reading material encourages terrorist activity, vote Libertarian. You want folks to leave you alone, move to the Moon. Damn! That is MY place, and you all leave it alone! I've got to get busy and make millions so that I can build Luna City with my private Pleasure Dome, Xanadu, off on the horizon .... Marc msmall@xxxxxxxxxxxx=20 Cha robh b=E0s fir gun ghr=E0s fir!