I guess the unnamed writer's view makes sense if you think of "noise" as unwanted components of a signal, but that implies a rather process-oriented view. A better word to describe the resulting problem in the image might be "dirt", meaning stuff that's in the wrong place (as explained by Mary Douglas). Don Sweet ----- Original Message ----- From: Dana Myers To: pure-silver@xxxxxxxxxxxxx Sent: Wednesday, September 15, 2010 10:29 AM Subject: [pure-silver] Re: Rumors Of Film's Death Are Vastly Exaggerated On 9/14/2010 3:23 PM, Gerald Koch wrote: I was taken to task a couple of weeks ago for my description of grain. The writer corrected me saying that grain was noise. I suppose that in a digital sense this is true but for an analog photographer it sounds very strange. At the risk of wandering off-topic, I'm not so sure this makes sense. Grain seems to roughly parallel pixels, which relate to resolution. Noise would seem to be inaccuracy in the *values* recorded in the unit of resolution. Dana