[projectaon] Re: Possibly more on Trevor Newton
- From: McSwain LeRoy <simonaamanarfan@xxxxxxxxxxx>
- To: <projectaon@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
- Date: Mon, 9 Mar 2009 12:19:17 -0400
fellow kai lords,
as much as i myself am a critic of copyright, i have to agree with ingo's
conclusions. while, i disagree that it's morally wrong to avoid getting
separate permissions for every incidental use of a copyrighted work, that's not
the direction the law is moving in.
as far as likelihood of being sued goes, i think we'd be far more likely to be
sued by heirs than the original artist. for example, tolkien's heirs sued tsr
for printing the word 'hobbit' in one of their books and the heirs of composer
(or whatever he was) john cage sued 'the planets' for putting a moment of
silence on their album. i doubt the principals would have done that. (in
fact, i'm a little anxious about what will happen to project aon once the
original artists are gone.)
at any rate, tracking down the copyrights is the way we've always done it in
the past. good to keep project aon pure. so, when i go to project aon, i know
that i'm seeing only works where the creators want me to see them, not where
the creators are waiting with a team of lawyers to sue me.
besides, if mr. newton didn't die until 2002, he surely knew about the
internet, and if he wanted his works not to fade into oblivion, he could have
looked us up. :.)
for sommerlnd and the kai,
leroy
> From: projectaon@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> To: projectaon@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> Subject: [projectaon] Re: Possibly more on Trevor Newton
> Date: Fri, 6 Mar 2009 22:26:22 +0100
>
> On Friday 06 March 2009, Benjamin I Krefetz wrote:
> > On Fri, 6 Mar 2009, Ingo Kloecker wrote:
> > > On Friday 06 March 2009, Benjamin I Krefetz wrote:
> > >> On Fri, 6 Mar 2009, Ingo Kloecker wrote:
> > >>> On Friday 06 March 2009, Simon Osborne wrote:
> > >>>> Sam Seaver wrote:
> > >>>>> I contacted the writer of this blog:
> > >>>>>
> > >>>>> http://bearalley.blogspot.com/2007/02/david-roberts.html
> > >>>>> http://bearalley.blogspot.com/2008/12/flagrant-self-promotion-a
> > >>>>>rt -o f-war.html
> > >>>>>
> > >>>>> Who, on these two pages, mention an artist/editor named Trevor
> > >>>>> Newton. I didn't mention Project Aon, I just enquired after the
> > >>>>> man. Steve Holland wrote back within the hour and apparently,
> > >>>>> the Trevor Newton he mentioned died in 2002, aged 77.
> > >>>>
> > >>>> Ah. That would certainly explain the dearth of output since
> > >>>> 2000.
> > >>>>
> > >>>> :-\
> > >>>>
> > >>>> Jon, what is the best thing to try next? In the event of death,
> > >>>> copyright passes on to the next of kin. However, there's no
> > >>>> saying that Mrs Newton is still around, and trying to trace the
> > >>>> actual holders to the second or third generation looks to be
> > >>>> even more difficult than finding out about the man himself.
> > >>>>
> > >>>> My personal opinion is that we should go ahead and use his
> > >>>> artwork, since the copyright is now in such muddied waters. It
> > >>>> is clearly not depriving anyone of revenue, we've made a real
> > >>>> effort to track the holders down, but it has not proved
> > >>>> possible. Should anyone come forward and ask us to remove it, we
> > >>>> could--it is most doubtful that would ever happen. Indeed, it's
> > >>>> most likely that the current copyright holder (Mr Newton's
> > >>>> children or grandchildren) is unaware of his work for one book
> > >>>> by an 'obscure fantasy author'. ;-)
> > >>>
> > >>> I don't think we should use his artwork without his or his heirs'
> > >>> consent. Apart from it being illegal, it's also just not right to
> > >>> do so. After all, we expect everybody to respect the Project Aon
> > >>> License. Moreover, a copyright infringement lawsuit could easily
> > >>> be the death of Project Aon.
> > >>
> > >> I'm with Simon on this. We've made a good faith effort to track
> > >> him down. In the very unlikely event that the current copyright
> > >> holder discovered we were using his work and actually cared, I
> > >> think a cease and desist order would be much more likely than a
> > >> lawsuit.
> > >
> > > Even a cease and desist order will cost quite a bit of money.
> >
> > Uhh... how's that? The whole point of a cease and desist is that the
> > copyright holder just wants you to stop using their works, and if you
> > stop they won't take you to court or seek damages. I don't know if
> > it's different in countries that don't use British Common Law, but
> > since the copyright was established in the UK, it's moot.
> >
> > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cease_and_desist
>
> I'm not talking about damages.
>
> In Germany, the lawyer who drafts the cease-and-desist letter will ask
> for reimbursement of his costs. And lawyers are expensive.
>
>
> Regards,
> Ingo
>
> ~~~~~~
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>
>
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