Hello,
With reference to the video. One of the examples the speaker used was
Daniel. The king signed a “law” and put it into effect and the speaker
then stressed about the actions that Daniel took and how important he
felt it was. But, he fails to mention a very important aspect about
Daniel. At the very end of the verse it clearly states “...as he did
aforetime.” (Dan. 6:10b) So, if the speaker of this video is correct and
that Daniel was making a show of his defiance by his posturing and
position, then can we not also conclude that before the “law” had gone
into effect that Daniel was also doing those things as a show, not of
defiance but of his piety? I only say that because of how that verse
ended with “...as he did aforetime” or put more simply “...as he did
before” (What he did before he was doing now!). We know that is not the
case, *by any means*, for Daniel was a “faithful” man with no “fault
found in him” (6:4) and he was definitely not a “see me, see me” man.
So, I believe that this speaker is reading into this section of verses
and attempting to make them say something that they are not, which he in
the beginning of the video very pointedly stated that it is wrong to do.
Was Daniel defying the “law” of the king? Yes. Was he making a show of
it? Was he proclaiming from the rooftops that he didn’t agree with the
new “law” and would defy it? Was he publishing a writing on how this new
“law” went against his rights and how he was going to fight it? *No!* He
was doing exactly what he had done before the “law” took effect. There
was no change of behavior with Daniel. As far as he was concerned it was
just another day. Why do you think those men went to the king to get him
to make this new “law”? They knew his character and his schedule, thus
they knew they could catch him.
I realize that the main focus of the video was to show that the
Scriptures do not promote a full submission to the authorities. I agree
with that premise. IF a law is enacted that says there will be no more
praying, would that truly stop a believer from praying? Absolutely not!
It didn’t stop Daniel. IF a law is enacted that says there will be no
more church meetings whatsoever, would that truly stop 2-3 believers
from gathering together even in secret? Absolutely not! History has
proven this over and over.
But, is it the “duty” of the believer to defy these “laws”? The speaker
of this video has a ministry that is devoted to the duty to defy (Defy
Tyrants). What he doesn’t seem to realize is that when there is a “duty”
then it is works and not grace! If a true believer defies any law, it is
because of the love one has for their Redeemer and has absolutely
nothing to do with “duty”. Thus I strongly disagree with his last slide
on the video which says: “/When the State commands that which God
forbids or forbid that which God commands – we have the duty to obey God
rather than man./” Again, if it is a “duty” then it is works! Did Daniel
defy out of “duty” or out of “love and reverence to God”?
I also wanted to bring up something that hopefully most have thought
about already. *Consequences!* If you are given to defy the government
then be prepared to face the consequences. Looking at Daniel, he knew
the “law” was put into effect thus he also knew the consequences of
defying that law. It made absolutely no difference to him. There is no
record of him denying it, nor of him begging for his life nor saying he
was sorry! He was made willing to pay the price if need be. This is
completely contrary to the “antifa” groups that are making so much noise
these days. They want to defy anything and everything they can but then
when confronted with any type of consequence they cry “foul” and attempt
to play the victim.
In hope,
Tom
On 1/28/21 5:17 PM, Tom Adams wrote:
Hello,
Just some food for thought.
The speaker of this video is Pastor Matt Trewhella. He is the pastor
of a "church" called *Mercy Seat Christian Church* based in Milwaukee,
Wisconsin. I was not familiar with him nor this video before I
received the email below. I noticed that the name of the YouTube
channel was "Defy Tyrants" and simply did a search in DuckDuckGo for
that name and found out that there is also a web-site with that name.
On the site it has his name along with the name of the church he
pastors. I then did a search for the "church" to see what I could
find. Attached is their "Catechism" which I downloaded from his
"church" site.
Please take time to download and peruse the Catechism before you take
a lot of stock in what he has to say in the video. Yes, the Lord spoke
through an ass in the Old Testament, therefore I fully believe He can
speak truth through any man if He so desires. Yet, I personally feel
it is good to know a little about the speaker and what their basis of
truth is.
Here is his web-site Defy Tyrants: https://defytyrants.com/
<https://defytyrants.com/>
Here is his "church" web-site: http://mercyseat.net/mscc/
<http://mercyseat.net/mscc/>
In hope,
Tom Adams
On 1/28/21 5:16 PM, Tom Adams wrote:
-------- Forwarded Message --------
------------------------------------------------------------------------
*From:* Lyal Lund <buzzsaw0311@xxxxxxxxxxx>
*Sent:* Saturday, January 23, 2021 1:11 PM
*To:* HOYT D. F. SPARKS <hoytsparks@xxxxxxxxxxx>
*Subject:* Re: Rom 13, civil government and the Christian
Actually I dont even know how to post on the forum: But feel free to
do so if you wish. I will add one more comment to the end of it tho,
if you do post it.
------------------------------------------------------------------------
*From:* HOYT D. F. SPARKS <hoytsparks@xxxxxxxxxxx>
*Sent:* Saturday, January 23, 2021 10:14 AM
*To:* Lyal Lund <buzzsaw0311@xxxxxxxxxxx>
*Subject:* Re: Rom 13, civil government and the Christian
Why don't you post to the forum: predestinarianbaptist@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
------------------------------------------------------------------------
*From:* Lyal Lund <buzzsaw0311@xxxxxxxxxxx>
*Sent:* Saturday, January 23, 2021 02:13
*Subject:* Rom 13, civil government and the Christian
Ok folks, my apology, the other day I sent out an email to everyone
that was supposed to have this link with it, but apparently it did
not make it on the email. Now retrying. Please note that in addition
to this vid, I believe the God ordained authority in this nation is
NOT the government, but rather the Constitution, to which both
government and the people are to be submitted too. It is the right
and duty of each side, that when the other side is found to be out of
compliance, it is to be forced, if need be, back into compliance (the
need for the Second Amendment).
The Christian and Patriot, who then enters the struggle against a
tyrannical, unconstitutional government, is NOT in violation of Rom
13 at all, but rather in obedience to it.
Further, as the vid points out, submission in scripture, wherever
taught, is NOT a moral absolute, for unlimited submission belongs to
God alone and never to sinful man. rom 13, as all such submission
passages show, is a general principal only. For instance, a
congregation is to submit to the leadership of the church. However,
if that leadership is found to be teaching doctrine contrary to God's
Word, it is to remove that leadership and appoint other leadership
more faithful to Scripture. In terms of the government and the
Christian, to be sure, we are to be model citizens, we are to pay our
taxes, obey the laws. However when government becomes oppressive and
tyrannical, our very Constitution states We The People, have the
right to alter or abolish such government and appoint a new
government that respects our rights. The Founders understood very
well something called 'Natural Law', that our rights come to us from
God and are inherent in creation. Government does NOT grant such
rights, nor can it take them away.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FzrdKYFR-1E
<https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.youtube.com%2Fwatch%3Fv%3DFzrdKYFR-1E&data=04%7C01%7C%7C7fdd86d918714d6558c208d8bf6e724b%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C637469828372435619%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C1000&sdata=lLDpnYjeXkqaTBH1bAQ23bZO3tm7EqQcRTZSyInQIuY%3D&reserved=0>
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