[lit-ideas] Re: Annals of Ancient Roman Literature
- From: "" <dmarc-noreply@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> (Redacted sender "Jlsperanza@xxxxxxx" for DMARC)
- To: lit-ideas@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
- Date: Mon, 3 Aug 2015 11:52:37 -0400
We are considering whether 'ferrum' (Latin for 'iron', the chemical
element) had more than one sense. Grice suggests it has only one sense: the
chemical element. If it is used for 'any thing made of' that chemical element,
there is a conversational maxim operating:
alla
i. Do not be more informative than is required.
It may be argued that 'ferrum' to mean the chemical element is LESS
informative than 'ferrum' used to refer to 'any thing made of' that chemical
element. But surely 'ferrum' has to be instantiated (as philosophers would say)
in some thing -- or other --, unless we are speaking of 'ferrum' _in
abstracto_.
In a message dated 8/3/2015 2:14:21 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time,
donalmcevoyuk@xxxxxxxxxxx writes:
This is hardly right: if before my gladitorial debut I asked my friend to
bring me the best "ferrum" he could find and he brought not a sword but a
shiny iron kettle, or even just a lump of high quality iron, I would surely
think he has mistaken the sense of my request and the sense in which I used
"ferrum". It is wrong (in such cases) to suggest we can have a transferred
usage but still only "ONE SENSE". It is more accurate to recognise that
every distinct "usage" represents a distinct "sense".
the sense of my request.
Here the keyword is Fregeian. There is a sense of LEXEMES, and sense of
utterances (including requests). So one has to be careful there. We are
referring to a request such as:
ii. Bring me the best 'ferrum' you can find.
cfr. Searle ("Indirect Speech acts"):
iii. Pass me the salt.
iv. Pass me the salt container.
It is more accurate to recognise that every distinct 'usage'
represents a distinct 'sense'.
Alla:
Multiply senses beyond necessity.
While 'ferrum' may be said to have an 'usage', it is more problematic, but
not impossible, to suggest that a complete request, such as:
ii. Bring me please the best 'ferrum' you can find, will you?
The sense of a sentence for Frege is a complex matter (while the sense of a
lexeme is mere what is not its denotatum -- 'meaning' is comprised of
'sense' PLUS denotatum -- as per Black's and Geach's tr. of "Ueber Sinn und
Bedeutung". So again we have to be careful there.
I would think that a Griceian analysis would run as follows.
An ancient Roman, by uttering 'ferrum' (thereby meaning 'sword') is abiding
by the maxims of the conversational cooperative principle.
In a gladatorial combat, the use of the sense 'chemical element with this
atomic structure' is thus narrowed down to 'and shaped as a weapon'.
But this may lead us to Ancient Roman chemistry.
Note that a child -- even an Ancient Roman child -- may be given a 'ferrum'
as a birthday present, made of plastic, say -- cfr. 'plastic flower' which
is not a flower, strictly. In this case, the exploitation of the maxims is
different, and we hope the child will understand that he was given a
plastic thing 'in the shape of a 'ferrum', i.e. sword,' rather than a
sword-sword (ferrum-ferrum).
It's all different if the birthday present is a 'gladius', plastic or not.
Cheers,
Speranza
On Monday, 3 August 2015, 1:26, David Ritchie <profdritchie@xxxxxxxxx>
wrote:
I've done three posts, so I'll confine myself to a quick, "brill, thank
you."
David Ritchie
etc.
On Aug 2, 2015, at 4:52 PM, (Redacted sender "Jlsperanza@xxxxxxx" for
DMARC) wrote:
Well, there's Short and Lewis, entry in ps. It may do to compare with the
entry for 'gladius', indeed!
Indeed, this -- 'ferrum' -- is what Grice would call a fossilised
implicature. It's not like 'ferrum' has TWO SENSES: but ONE SENSE and a
transferred
usage.
Cheers,
Speranza
------------------------------------------------------------------
To change your Lit-Ideas settings (subscribe/unsub, vacation on/off,
digest on/off), visit www.andreas.com/faq-lit-ideas.html
Other related posts:
