Hi Arjan, I understand, I deal with these "flat earthers" a lot myself :) If you remove the ISA firewall in the DMZ, you can use the back-end ISA firewall for FTP uploads and downloads. HTH, Tom www.isaserver.org/shinder Tom and Deb Shinder's Configuring ISA Server 2004 http://tinyurl.com/3xqb7 MVP -- ISA Firewalls -----Original Message----- From: AHendriks@xxxxxx [mailto:AHendriks@xxxxxx] Sent: Monday, April 18, 2005 7:17 AM To: [ISAserver.org Discussion List] Subject: [isalist] RE: FTP Connection http://www.ISAserver.org Tom, I know, but it's an other department which designd and maintains the networking configuration, they think Cisco is good and MS is bad, i have to deal with it, and make it work. Arjan > -----Original Message----- > From: Thomas W Shinder [mailto:tshinder@xxxxxxxxxxx] > Sent: maandag 18 april 2005 14:12 > To: [ISAserver.org Discussion List] > Subject: [isalist] RE: FTP Connection > > http://www.ISAserver.org > > Hi Arjan, > > I think there's way too much redundancy here. What is the > second PIX doing? I know there is a mythology about PIXs > actually providing security, but its just that, a mythology. > I would remove the back-end PIX since its not doing anything > but complicating the configuration. > Also, the ISA firewall in the DMZ is not required either, > since the back-end ISA firewall can do what you want it to do. > > A far superior configuration is this: > > PIX--DMZ--ISA firewall--corpnet > > HTH, > > > Tom > www.isaserver.org/shinder > Tom and Deb Shinder's Configuring ISA Server 2004 > http://tinyurl.com/3xqb7 > MVP -- ISA Firewalls > > > -----Original Message----- > From: AHendriks@xxxxxx [mailto:AHendriks@xxxxxx] > Sent: Monday, April 18, 2005 7:01 AM > To: [ISAserver.org Discussion List] > Subject: [isalist] RE: FTP Connection > > http://www.ISAserver.org > > I think that's impossible for the configuration used here, > we're using the following: > > > Internet - PIX - ISA 2004 - PIX - ISA 2004 - Corpnet > > The interfaces between both pix's uses the same network id, > and between the pix and the corpnet they are the same to. > > We don't need the firewall, only the proxy part. > > Can i say that in this configuration the ftp uploads not > work, and will not work. > > Arjan > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: Thomas W Shinder [mailto:tshinder@xxxxxxxxxxx] > > Sent: maandag 18 april 2005 13:51 > > To: [ISAserver.org Discussion List] > > Subject: [isalist] RE: FTP Connection > > > > http://www.ISAserver.org > > > > When you place the second NIC in the ISA firewall, then > each NIC will > > need to be on a different network ID. > > > > Setup should be something like this: > > > > Internet--ISA firewall 1--DMZ--ISA firewall 2--corpnet > > > > HTH, > > > > > > Tom > > www.isaserver.org/shinder > > Tom and Deb Shinder's Configuring ISA Server 2004 > > http://tinyurl.com/3xqb7 > > MVP -- ISA Firewalls > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: AHendriks@xxxxxx [mailto:AHendriks@xxxxxx] > > Sent: Monday, April 18, 2005 6:43 AM > > To: [ISAserver.org Discussion List] > > Subject: [isalist] RE: FTP Connection > > > > http://www.ISAserver.org > > > > When adding a second NIC, i don't need to change to the Single NIC > > Template, but can keep the current settings, without a > second nic it's > > impossible to upload files through the ISA to the internet > with FTP ? > > > > I'm using a parent child configuration, have a parent ISA > box in the > > dmz and a child ISA box in the LAN, which connects the users, do i > > need to use on both servers a second NIC for enable FTP uploads > > through ISA ? > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > From: Thomas W Shinder [mailto:tshinder@xxxxxxxxxxx] > > > Sent: maandag 18 april 2005 13:34 > > > To: [ISAserver.org Discussion List] > > > Subject: [isalist] RE: FTP Connection > > > > > > http://www.ISAserver.org > > > > > > Two options: > > > > > > 1. Add a second NIC (obviously the preferred option) 2. Use Web > > > proxied HTTP tunneled FTP for download only > > > > > > HTH< > > > > > > > > > Tom > > > www.isaserver.org/shinder > > > Tom and Deb Shinder's Configuring ISA Server 2004 > > > http://tinyurl.com/3xqb7 > > > MVP -- ISA Firewalls > > > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > From: AHendriks@xxxxxx [mailto:AHendriks@xxxxxx] > > > Sent: Monday, April 18, 2005 1:04 AM > > > To: [ISAserver.org Discussion List] > > > Subject: [isalist] RE: FTP Connection > > > > > > http://www.ISAserver.org > > > > > > After operating with the "Single Network Adapter" what's > > the next step > > > to allow FTP transfers ? > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > > From: Jim Harrison [mailto:Jim@xxxxxxxxxxxx] > > > > Sent: maandag 11 april 2005 15:46 > > > > To: [ISAserver.org Discussion List] > > > > Subject: [isalist] RE: FTP Connection > > > > > > > > http://www.ISAserver.org > > > > > > > > This is exactly why I sent you those links. > > > > You MUST operate a single NIC ISA with the "Single > > Network Adapter" > > > > template. > > > > > > > > Take a read in those articles - they explain it all for you. > > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > > From: AHendriks@xxxxxx [mailto:AHendriks@xxxxxx] > > > > Sent: Monday, April 11, 2005 12:56 AM > > > > To: [ISAserver.org Discussion List] > > > > Subject: [isalist] RE: FTP Connection > > > > > > > > http://www.ISAserver.org > > > > > > > > > > > > With the current setup with a single NIC (i havent' used > > the Single > > > > NIC template, but using the default Edge Firewall), i'm > > > unable to send > > > > files through FTP to a another site. > > > > > > > > The only possible FTP connection with ISA with this > > > configuration is > > > > FTP over HTTP which i have enabled and which is working > > right now, > > > > which steps do i need to take to let users send files > > > through FTP to > > > > sites on the internet ? > > > > > > > > Arjan > > > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > > > From: Jim Harrison [mailto:Jim@xxxxxxxxxxxx] > > > > > Sent: vrijdag 8 april 2005 15:15 > > > > > To: [ISAserver.org Discussion List] > > > > > Subject: [isalist] RE: FTP Connection > > > > > > > > > > http://www.ISAserver.org > > > > > > > > > > Take a look here: > > > > > http://support.microsoft.com/?id=838364 > > > > > ..and here: > > > > > http://support.microsoft.com/?id=840471 > > > > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > > > From: AHendriks@xxxxxx [mailto:AHendriks@xxxxxx] > > > > > Sent: Thursday, April 07, 2005 11:14 PM > > > > > To: [ISAserver.org Discussion List] > > > > > Subject: [isalist] RE: FTP Connection > > > > > > > > > > http://www.ISAserver.org > > > > > > > > > > I'm unable to connect to any ftp site with the dos ftp > > > > client, cause i > > > > > can't connect through the isa server with the dos client. > > > > > I think you mean connecting to ftp sites which uses the > > > isa server, > > > > > but i need to connect through the isa server to a ftp site. > > > > > > > > > > Arjan > > > > > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > > > > From: Troy Armour [mailto:troy@xxxxxxxxxx] > > > > > > Sent: donderdag 7 april 2005 14:33 > > > > > > To: [ISAserver.org Discussion List] > > > > > > Subject: [isalist] RE: FTP Connection > > > > > > > > > > > > http://www.ISAserver.org > > > > > > > > > > > > im coming in late to this discussion but doesn't the dos > > > > ftp client > > > > > > work fine for uploading files-i have used it with no > > > problems on > > > > > > numerous sites that use the web proxy. and it allows you to > > > > > script a > > > > > > file to auto log in if you want > > > > > > > > > > > > troy > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > > > > From: <AHendriks@xxxxxx> > > > > > > To: "[ISAserver.org Discussion List]" > <isalist@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> > > > > > > Sent: Thursday, April 07, 2005 11:31 AM > > > > > > Subject: [isalist] RE: FTP Connection > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > http://www.ISAserver.org > > > > > > > > > > > > Thanx Jim, the syntax did the job, but my users wanted to > > > > > upload files > > > > > > to, is SOCKS4 the only solution ? > > > > > > > > > > > > I have searched for SOCK4 in the help, but haven't find > > > > > enough to get > > > > > > it working, i have enabled the SOCKS4 filter, and have > > > > enabled the > > > > > > internal interface for listning, but with netstat -an the > > > > > port isn't > > > > > > available, and i'm unable to connect with Ws_Ftp with socks > > > > > enabled to > > > > > > a ftp site outside. > > > > > > > > > > > > Can you give me a hint about the next steps to take. > > > > > > > > > > > > Regards, > > > > > > > > > > > > Arjan > > > > > > > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > > > > > From: Jim Harrison [mailto:Jim@xxxxxxxxxxxx] > > > > > > > Sent: woensdag 6 april 2005 15:58 > > > > > > > To: [ISAserver.org Discussion List] > > > > > > > Subject: [isalist] RE: FTP Connection > > > > > > > > > > > > > > http://www.ISAserver.org > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ISA Web proxy doesn't support FTP authentication > > > "passthrough". > > > > > > > You have to connect using the > > > > > > ftp://user:password@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx form. > > > > > > > Also, the web proxy only supports FTP "download" - it's > > > > > not possible > > > > > > > to send data to an FTP server through the Web Proxy. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ISA supports SOCKS4 - read all about it in the help. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > > > > > From: AHendriks@xxxxxx [mailto:AHendriks@xxxxxx] > > > > > > > Sent: Wednesday, April 06, 2005 5:12 AM > > > > > > > To: [ISAserver.org Discussion List] > > > > > > > Subject: [isalist] FTP Connection > > > > > > > > > > > > > > http://www.ISAserver.org > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I'm trying to set up a FTP connection from my client > > > > > workstation to > > > > > > > a ftp site, i have tried a lot of clients, but can't > > > get anyone > > > > > > > working right now. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > With IE i'm able to connect to a site which is anonymous, > > > > > but when i > > > > > > > try a site with credentials required, i got the error > > > > > message that > > > > > > > the host is unavailable, have tried the site > > > > > > > ftp://updates.oracle.com but the same error apears. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > With Reflection i found that Reflection doesn't support > > > > > HTTP proxy > > > > > > > connections, only socks is supported, don't know if ISA > > > > > support it. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > With FlashFXP i'm able to turn in to HTTP proxy mode, but > > > > > then i got > > > > > > > the message that the ssl port is not allowed. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Which ftp client is the easyst one in use, and which > > > > > configuration > > > > > > > settings do i need to make to allow the ftp sessions. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Arjan > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------ > > > > > > > List Archives: > > > > 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> > > Windows Security Resource Site: > > > > > > > http://www.windowsecurity.com/ Network Security Library: > > > > > > > http://www.secinf.net/ Windows 2000/NT Fax Solutions: > > > > > > > http://www.ntfaxfaq.com > > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------ > > > > > > > You are currently subscribed to this ISAserver.org > > > > > Discussion List > > > > > > > as: ahendriks@xxxxxx To unsubscribe visit > > > > > > > http://www.webelists.com/cgi/lyris.pl?enter=isalist > > > > > > > Report abuse to listadmin@xxxxxxxxxxxxx > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------ > > > > > > List Archives: > > > http://www.webelists.com/cgi/lyris.pl?enter=isalist > > > > > > ISA Server Newsletter: > > > > http://www.isaserver.org/pages/newsletter.asp > > > > > > ISA Server FAQ: > > > > http://www.isaserver.org/pages/larticle.asp?type=FAQ > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------ > > > > > > Other Internet Software Marketing Sites: > > > > > > World of Windows Networking: > > > > > http://www.windowsnetworking.com Leading > > > > > > Network Software Directory: http://www.serverfiles.com > > > > > > No.1 Exchange Server Resource Site: > > > > > http://www.msexchange.org Windows > > > > > > Security Resource Site: > > http://www.windowsecurity.com/ Network > > > > > > Security Library: http://www.secinf.net/ Windows 2000/NT Fax > > > > > > Solutions: http://www.ntfaxfaq.com > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------ > > > > > > You are currently subscribed to this ISAserver.org > > > > > Discussion List as: > > > > > > troy@xxxxxxxxxx > > > > > > To unsubscribe visit > > > > > > http://www.webelists.com/cgi/lyris.pl?enter=isalist > > > > > > Report abuse to listadmin@xxxxxxxxxxxxx > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------ > > > > > > List Archives: > > > http://www.webelists.com/cgi/lyris.pl?enter=isalist > > > > > > 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> > > > ------------------------------------------------------ > > > > > You are currently subscribed to this ISAserver.org > > > > Discussion List as: > > > > > jim@xxxxxxxxxxxx > > > > > To unsubscribe visit > > > > > http://www.webelists.com/cgi/lyris.pl?enter=isalist > > > > > Report abuse to listadmin@xxxxxxxxxxxxx > > > > > > > > > > All mail to and from this domain is GFI-scanned. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------ > > > > > List Archives: > > http://www.webelists.com/cgi/lyris.pl?enter=isalist > > > > > ISA Server Newsletter: > > > http://www.isaserver.org/pages/newsletter.asp > > > > > ISA Server FAQ: > > > http://www.isaserver.org/pages/larticle.asp?type=FAQ > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------ > > > > > Other Internet Software Marketing Sites: > > > > > World of Windows Networking: > > > > http://www.windowsnetworking.com Leading > > > > > Network Software Directory: http://www.serverfiles.com > > > > > No.1 Exchange Server Resource Site: > > > > http://www.msexchange.org Windows > > > > > Security Resource Site: > > > > > http://www.windowsecurity.com/ Network Security Library: > > > > > http://www.secinf.net/ Windows 2000/NT Fax Solutions: > > > > > http://www.ntfaxfaq.com > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------ > > > > > You are currently subscribed to this ISAserver.org > > > > Discussion List as: > > > > > ahendriks@xxxxxx To unsubscribe visit > > > > > http://www.webelists.com/cgi/lyris.pl?enter=isalist > > > > > Report abuse to listadmin@xxxxxxxxxxxxx > > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------ > > > > List Archives: > http://www.webelists.com/cgi/lyris.pl?enter=isalist > > > > ISA Server Newsletter: > > http://www.isaserver.org/pages/newsletter.asp > > > > ISA Server FAQ: > > http://www.isaserver.org/pages/larticle.asp?type=FAQ > > > > ------------------------------------------------------ > > > > Other Internet Software Marketing Sites: > > > > World of Windows Networking: > > > http://www.windowsnetworking.com Leading > > > > Network Software Directory: http://www.serverfiles.com > > > > No.1 Exchange Server Resource Site: > > > http://www.msexchange.org Windows > > > > Security Resource Site: http://www.windowsecurity.com/ Network > > > > Security Library: http://www.secinf.net/ Windows 2000/NT Fax > > > > Solutions: http://www.ntfaxfaq.com > > > > ------------------------------------------------------ > > > > You are currently subscribed to this ISAserver.org > > > Discussion List as: > > > > jim@xxxxxxxxxxxx > > > > To unsubscribe visit > > > > http://www.webelists.com/cgi/lyris.pl?enter=isalist > > > > Report abuse to listadmin@xxxxxxxxxxxxx > > > > > > > > All mail to and from this domain is GFI-scanned. > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------ > > > > List Archives: > http://www.webelists.com/cgi/lyris.pl?enter=isalist > > > > ISA Server Newsletter: > > http://www.isaserver.org/pages/newsletter.asp > > > > ISA Server FAQ: > > http://www.isaserver.org/pages/larticle.asp?type=FAQ > > > > ------------------------------------------------------ > > > > Other Internet Software Marketing Sites: > > > > World of Windows Networking: > > > http://www.windowsnetworking.com Leading > > > > Network Software Directory: http://www.serverfiles.com > > > > No.1 Exchange Server Resource Site: > > > http://www.msexchange.org Windows > > > > Security Resource Site: http://www.windowsecurity.com/ Network > > > > Security Library: http://www.secinf.net/ Windows 2000/NT Fax > > > > Solutions: http://www.ntfaxfaq.com > > > > ------------------------------------------------------ > > > > You are currently subscribed to this ISAserver.org > > > Discussion List as: > > > > ahendriks@xxxxxx To unsubscribe visit > > > > http://www.webelists.com/cgi/lyris.pl?enter=isalist > > > > Report abuse to listadmin@xxxxxxxxxxxxx > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------ > > > List Archives: http://www.webelists.com/cgi/lyris.pl?enter=isalist > > > ISA Server Newsletter: > http://www.isaserver.org/pages/newsletter.asp > > > ISA Server FAQ: > http://www.isaserver.org/pages/larticle.asp?type=FAQ > > > ------------------------------------------------------ > > > Other Internet Software Marketing Sites: > > > World of Windows Networking: > > http://www.windowsnetworking.com Leading > > > Network Software Directory: http://www.serverfiles.com > > > No.1 Exchange Server Resource Site: > > http://www.msexchange.org Windows > > > Security Resource Site: > > > http://www.windowsecurity.com/ Network Security Library: > > > http://www.secinf.net/ Windows 2000/NT Fax Solutions: > > > http://www.ntfaxfaq.com > > > ------------------------------------------------------ > > > You are currently subscribed to this ISAserver.org > > Discussion List as: > > > tshinder@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx > > > To unsubscribe visit > > > http://www.webelists.com/cgi/lyris.pl?enter=isalist > > > Report abuse to listadmin@xxxxxxxxxxxxx > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------ > > > List Archives: http://www.webelists.com/cgi/lyris.pl?enter=isalist > > > ISA Server Newsletter: > http://www.isaserver.org/pages/newsletter.asp > > > ISA Server FAQ: > http://www.isaserver.org/pages/larticle.asp?type=FAQ > > > ------------------------------------------------------ > > > Other Internet Software Marketing Sites: > > > World of Windows Networking: > > http://www.windowsnetworking.com Leading > > > Network Software Directory: http://www.serverfiles.com > > > No.1 Exchange Server Resource Site: > > http://www.msexchange.org Windows > > > Security Resource Site: > > > http://www.windowsecurity.com/ Network Security Library: > > > http://www.secinf.net/ Windows 2000/NT Fax Solutions: > > > http://www.ntfaxfaq.com > > > ------------------------------------------------------ > > > You are currently subscribed to this ISAserver.org > > Discussion List as: > > > ahendriks@xxxxxx To unsubscribe visit > > > http://www.webelists.com/cgi/lyris.pl?enter=isalist > > > Report abuse to listadmin@xxxxxxxxxxxxx > > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------ > > List Archives: http://www.webelists.com/cgi/lyris.pl?enter=isalist > > ISA Server Newsletter: http://www.isaserver.org/pages/newsletter.asp > > ISA Server FAQ: http://www.isaserver.org/pages/larticle.asp?type=FAQ > > ------------------------------------------------------ > > Other Internet Software Marketing Sites: > > World of Windows Networking: > http://www.windowsnetworking.com Leading > > Network Software Directory: http://www.serverfiles.com > > No.1 Exchange Server Resource Site: > http://www.msexchange.org Windows > > Security Resource Site: http://www.windowsecurity.com/ Network > > Security Library: http://www.secinf.net/ Windows 2000/NT Fax > > Solutions: http://www.ntfaxfaq.com > > ------------------------------------------------------ > > You are currently subscribed to this ISAserver.org > Discussion List as: > > tshinder@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx > > To unsubscribe visit > > http://www.webelists.com/cgi/lyris.pl?enter=isalist > > Report abuse to listadmin@xxxxxxxxxxxxx > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------ > > List Archives: http://www.webelists.com/cgi/lyris.pl?enter=isalist > > ISA Server Newsletter: http://www.isaserver.org/pages/newsletter.asp > > ISA Server FAQ: http://www.isaserver.org/pages/larticle.asp?type=FAQ > > ------------------------------------------------------ > > Other Internet Software Marketing Sites: > > World of Windows Networking: > http://www.windowsnetworking.com Leading > > Network Software Directory: http://www.serverfiles.com > > No.1 Exchange Server Resource Site: > http://www.msexchange.org Windows > > Security Resource Site: http://www.windowsecurity.com/ Network > > Security Library: http://www.secinf.net/ Windows 2000/NT Fax > > Solutions: http://www.ntfaxfaq.com > > ------------------------------------------------------ > > You are currently subscribed to this ISAserver.org > Discussion List as: > > ahendriks@xxxxxx To unsubscribe visit > > http://www.webelists.com/cgi/lyris.pl?enter=isalist > > Report abuse to listadmin@xxxxxxxxxxxxx > > > > ------------------------------------------------------ > List Archives: http://www.webelists.com/cgi/lyris.pl?enter=isalist > ISA Server Newsletter: http://www.isaserver.org/pages/newsletter.asp > ISA Server FAQ: http://www.isaserver.org/pages/larticle.asp?type=FAQ > ------------------------------------------------------ > Other Internet Software Marketing Sites: > World of Windows Networking: http://www.windowsnetworking.com > Leading Network Software Directory: http://www.serverfiles.com > No.1 Exchange Server Resource Site: http://www.msexchange.org > Windows Security Resource Site: > http://www.windowsecurity.com/ Network Security Library: > http://www.secinf.net/ Windows 2000/NT Fax Solutions: > http://www.ntfaxfaq.com > ------------------------------------------------------ > You are currently subscribed to this ISAserver.org Discussion List as: > tshinder@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx > To unsubscribe visit > http://www.webelists.com/cgi/lyris.pl?enter=isalist > Report abuse to listadmin@xxxxxxxxxxxxx > > > > ------------------------------------------------------ > List Archives: http://www.webelists.com/cgi/lyris.pl?enter=isalist > ISA Server Newsletter: http://www.isaserver.org/pages/newsletter.asp > ISA Server FAQ: http://www.isaserver.org/pages/larticle.asp?type=FAQ > ------------------------------------------------------ > Other Internet Software Marketing Sites: > World of Windows Networking: http://www.windowsnetworking.com > Leading Network Software Directory: http://www.serverfiles.com > No.1 Exchange Server Resource Site: http://www.msexchange.org > Windows Security Resource Site: > http://www.windowsecurity.com/ Network Security Library: > http://www.secinf.net/ Windows 2000/NT Fax Solutions: > http://www.ntfaxfaq.com > ------------------------------------------------------ > You are currently subscribed to this ISAserver.org Discussion > List as: ahendriks@xxxxxx To unsubscribe visit > http://www.webelists.com/cgi/lyris.pl?enter=isalist > Report abuse to listadmin@xxxxxxxxxxxxx > ------------------------------------------------------ List Archives: http://www.webelists.com/cgi/lyris.pl?enter=isalist ISA Server Newsletter: http://www.isaserver.org/pages/newsletter.asp ISA Server FAQ: http://www.isaserver.org/pages/larticle.asp?type=FAQ ------------------------------------------------------ Other Internet Software Marketing Sites: World of Windows Networking: http://www.windowsnetworking.com Leading Network Software Directory: http://www.serverfiles.com No.1 Exchange Server Resource Site: http://www.msexchange.org Windows Security Resource Site: http://www.windowsecurity.com/ Network Security Library: http://www.secinf.net/ Windows 2000/NT Fax Solutions: http://www.ntfaxfaq.com ------------------------------------------------------ You are currently subscribed to this ISAserver.org Discussion List as: tshinder@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx To unsubscribe visit http://www.webelists.com/cgi/lyris.pl?enter=isalist Report abuse to listadmin@xxxxxxxxxxxxx