RE: Climate Change and Other Things
- From: "Jim Mann" <jimmann@xxxxxxx>
- To: <dsp-ea-general@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
- Date: Sun, 6 Nov 2022 16:50:00 -0800
Bob..
I remember Wayne very well. In fact, I also worked for him for one summer –
lived in the frat house and was assigned to play with a PDP-9, the first of its
kind that he brought into the lab. Didn’t really accomplish anything but I
don’t think that was the object of the exercise anyhow. I best remember Wayne
for the parties he used to come to joining those of us in the first four year
degree program. He was the only Prof to do that and proved to be as good at
partying as he was at teaching. Sorry to hear of his passing. I credit him
for helping make my university experience not only fun but fairly successful
even with spending a fair share of time in the basement of the SUB playing
bridge or hearts. Good days….
jim
From: dsp-ea-general-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx <dsp-ea-general-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
On Behalf Of Bob Thomlinson
Sent: November 6, 2022 3:34 PM
To: dsp-ea-general@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: Re: Climate Change and Other Things
Jim,
Thanks Jim. I do remember borrowing your course notes and assignments because I
was too busy playing bridge and watching Laura Lindsay’s afternoon movies in
the fraternity house to bother attending a lot of classes. I was smart enough
to get to university at age 17 but maturity was a bit slow to catch up.
Eventually the Dean decided I needed to go away and grow up.
That all changed when I went back to finish my degree and my wife Marilyn was
supporting us. You might remember Prof. Wayne Davis who taught the computer
hardware class. The second time around I was so keen he hired me to support his
computer lab for various picture (photo) processing research projects. Bringing
home nines on my report card turned out to be far better than the bridge and
afternoon movies in the fraternity house. FYI - Wayne died this past August in
Edmonton at age 90.
Cheers,
Bob
On Nov 6, 2022, at 2:40 PM, Jim Mann <jimmann@xxxxxxx <mailto:jimmann@xxxxxxx>
wrote:
Bob…. of course you can pass it on. Kind of reminds my of when you used to
borrow my assignments in computer science class back in the day. I appreciate
the work you have done that enables this exchange of experiences and opinions
among the alumni of Delta Sigma Phi, Epsilon Alpha Chapter. I have many fond
memories of those days.
Kindest regards
Jim
From: dsp-ea-general-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
<
mailto:dsp-ea-general-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
<dsp-ea-general-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
<
mailto:dsp-ea-general-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> > On Behalf Of Bob Thomlinson
Sent: November 6, 2022 1:28 PM
To: dsp-ea-general@xxxxxxxxxxxxx <
mailto:dsp-ea-general@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: RE: Climate Change and Other Things
Jim,
Thank you for an extraordinarily articulate pieces of writing. Your compilation
of many different, but related events sounds like it could have come from Rex
Murphy, although he would have included a lot more obtuse English words that
require reference to a dictionary. This resonates with the views and opinions
of many of my friends, although none of us could say it so well. With your
permission I would like to pass this on some of those friends who I know would
also appreciate your candid assessment.
Cheers,
Bob T
From: dsp-ea-general-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
<
mailto:dsp-ea-general-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
<dsp-ea-general-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
<
mailto:dsp-ea-general-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> > On Behalf Of Jim Mann
Sent: November 6, 2022 12:23 PM
To: dsp-ea-general@xxxxxxxxxxxxx <
mailto:dsp-ea-general@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: Climate Change and Other Things
It has been very interesting reading the comments on climate change, causes and
actions we can take but I have difficulty in isolating climate change from all
the other things that are going on in the world and our country at present.
First of all, I believe that we are one of the most blessed generations of all
time. For the most part, we came into the world after the end of World War II
and have not experienced “global crises” really until these very early impacts
of climate change and the global pandemic of covid. I think we shall escape
the major impacts of these phenomena including environmental impacts,
socio-economic impacts and lifestyle impacts only because we will reach the end
of our life cycle before experiencing the most dire of their evolution and
their consequences.
As we near the end of our lives, we are witnessing catastrophes such as the war
in Ukraine where the rest of the world is either unwilling or unable to stop
Putin and Russia from the inhumane devastation of another country and the
United Nations is proving to be a joke with Russia having veto power over any
consequential resolutions. The threats from powerful nations such as Russia,
China and North Korea will not diminish. There may be “deferral actions” such
as the sanctions that are being implemented to defer the outcomes but there is
no solution.
We are witnessing the beginning of an increasing number of climate events that
are beginning to have an impact on our daily lives. It will not improve in our
lifetime and there is likely not even a long term solution. I think with the
number of trees that we have in Canada consuming carbon dioxide, that we are
likely already carbon neutral and, in any event, without China and India
leading the “green charge”, any actions by Canadians can only serve to “ease
our conscience” and have zero impact on the global climate change phenomena.
Much like with the covid pandemic where we focused 100% on prevention and 0% on
treatment, we are focusing Canadian efforts with the wrong focus. We can’t
stop it so prepare to deal with the consequences as best we can.
We are witnessing something in Canada referred to as reconciliation. This is a
never-ending discourse with no actual conclusion. We cannot change history nor
the consequences of colonization. We cannot solve a problem by vilifying Sir
John A. Macdonald and tearing down statues. We cannot reach a conclusion where
there is no benefit to the aggrieved party in ever saying “enough – we are
satisfied”. While wrongs were certainly done and ill-conceived but well
intended strategies were poorly executed, there is no way to make up for the
consequences.
We are witnessing a world and a nation where we can no longer trust the media –
either mainstream or the ever-increasing number of bloggers, webcasters and
other print or airwave sources. The only reliable source of “the truth” is
what we actually witness ourselves. The next time you listen to what purports
to be a newscast, ask yourself why that particular story was presented and
listen to hear the opinion components instead of pure factual reports. Even
where it is factual, why is only that side of the story being presented. Watch
how statistics are given to support a particular position but that mislead in
regard to the overall picture. The CBC in “reporting” on the current inquiry
into the government invocation of the emergency act spends 30% of the time
telling us what the witnesses are going to say, 10% of the time allowing us to
see selected live evidence and 60% of the time telling us what they thought the
witness said and what it meant and what their opinions are of the witness and
the evidence (see how statistics can be used to sound factual). While I used
to be a supporter of the CBC because they brought news and entertainment to
areas of Canada that could not be reached by other media and broadcasters, I no
longer am a supporter as they are biased, often incorrect and have an agenda
that I do not understand. We no longer have reporters, we have “news
commentators”. Where are the people like Lloyd Robertson, Knowlton Nash and
Peter Mansbridge? Thank you Rex Murphy! Or am I just being naïve.
We are witnessing a world and a nation where “governments” are increasingly
abusing their power for their own political and personal agendas - most
recently the Ontario and Quebec governments use of the “notwithstanding” clause
to violate the constitutional rights of Canadian citizens and the federal
governments invocation of the Emergencies Act during the protest in Ottawa.
One can argue that the ban on handgun ownership in Canada is also an over-reach
of authority – the major consequence of which will NOT be a reduction in crime
but an increase in the “freedom movement” and protests by citizens.
And we are witnessing the rise of the “freedom movement” where coups attempts
such as the January 6th storming of the Capitol and the “Freedom Convoy” all
across Canada will continue to grow and become increasingly violent. The
multiple convoys making up the “Freedom Convoy” and the fringe movements that
joined it was the “polite” Canadian version of the storming of the Capitol in
the United States. These resulted from government abuse of power, biased
media, an inability to get accurate sources of factual information, and much of
that is related to climate change and the pandemic. Many of those Canadian
“demonstrators” are our friends and neighbours concerned about their lives and
livelihood and we cannot and should not dismiss them as “nut cases”.
So yes, I have switched my horse trailer which I pull with a big diesel truck
over to LCD lighting (as I have much of my home) and I set my thermostat a few
degrees cooler and I do not air condition my home and I dutifully sort my items
into green bins of yard and compostable waste and blue bins of recyclables and
grey bins of the rest. But most of all I am thankful for belonging to the
generation that I belong to; the generation that really lived through the best
of times and ultimately benefited from the challenges our ancestors faced and
overcame and the generation that will not face the worst consequences of the
incredible debts our governments have incurred and the pollution we have
created.
YITBOS my brothers – we have had one hell of a ride!!
From: dsp-ea-general-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
<
mailto:dsp-ea-general-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
<dsp-ea-general-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
<
mailto:dsp-ea-general-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> > On Behalf Of Wynn Payne
Sent: November 4, 2022 2:05 PM
To: dsp-ea-general@xxxxxxxxxxxxx <
mailto:dsp-ea-general@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: Re: Natural verses anthropogenic climate change
Hi Bryan
Thanks for the detailed explanation. This makes sense to me.
As a second layer of the problem how much does Canada contribute to the problem
in relation to the whole world? My understand is that China and India combined
represent maybe 85% of the problem and that Canada is maybe 1%. Are those good
estimates?
If we are at say 3 % how much change do we have to do a less significant
contributor for the problem? ie we are making our standard of living more
expensive while not being a significant contributor. Unless we can get China
and India on side our efforts have little effect while economically they
manufacturer without the costs of reducing carbon contribution.
This last summer there was an initiative to reduce fertilizer use in grain
production. That seemed to be counter productive to supplying the world what
it needs to survive.
To all, keep the comments coming while remaining courteous.
Thanks
Wynn
On Fri, Nov 4, 2022 at 2:52 PM R Bryan Waller <dmarc-noreply@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
<
mailto:dmarc-noreply@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> > wrote:
Over the millennia earth has been subject to variable climate change
indépendant of the actions of mankind.There have been at least 5 distinct ice
ages in the past 650,000 years.These changes are due to a number of factors
including the tilt of earth orbit,warming and cooling of the oceans,volcanic
activity and variability of energy output by the sun.It is possible to chart
these changes through the examination of ice cores from the Greenland and
Antarctic ice caps.In support of those who believe the changes we are seeing
are due to natural causes we are at a point in the epoch where we are emerging
from the most recent ice age and there is a natural warming trend.
Having said that these natural trends are measured in tens of thousands of
years.Our current
accelerated warming trend has occurred in the last 250 years ,a mere thane
blink of an eye in time.It coïncides with the industrial revolution and the
burning of fossil fuels and explosive population growth.
Earths temperature has increased 5 degrees since the latest ice age more than
10,000 years ago which averages out to .05 degrees every 100 years.Over the
last 100 years the mean temperature of earth has increased 1.4 degrees.The
world is heating up exponentially faster than ever before.That is an undeniable
fact.Of course the warming is not a constant throughout the globe.Some areas
may be cooler than in the previous years.It is the planet as a whole that is
warming at a far greater rate than ever seen in the determinable record.
The reason is the increase in the so called greenhouse gases.The chief of these
is carbon dioxide but also include other gases such as methane and nitrous
oxide.They are called greenhouse gases because of particular qualities.They
transmit light but absorb and radiate infra red light.The world would be
uninhabitable if we did not have greenhouse gases because of their role in
warming the planet.
By the examination of air bubbles cast in ice cores scientists have determined
over the course of discernable history thé concentration of carbon dioxide in
the atmosphere has varied from 180 to 300 parts per million .Modern levels are
at more than 400 parts per million and increasing rapidly.There is no question
for the most part these emissions come from the burning of fossil
fuels.Scientist are able to differentiate fossil fuel carbon dioxide from
naturally occurring carbon dioxide.Other greenhouse gases such as methane and
nitrous oxide which have an even greater warming effect are also
increasing.Methane comes from rotting garbage and belching cows and nitrous
oxide from the use of nitrogen fertilizers.
The evidence is overwhelming and is found in the rapidity of these events far
exceeding any natural discernable natural occurrences.There are charts and
scientific literature than explains it far better than I can but here are the
bare bones of the argument.As I have said this is an accepted conclusion from
the vast majority of climate scientists.There may be the odd outlier but I have
never seen one with any credibility.The earth has been able to adapt to changes
over the millennia but can it adapt to dramatic change over centuries? We
humans are ingenious creatures and perhaps we will adapt ….or perhaps not.Bryan
Sent from my iPad
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