I agree with you Robert. It is a difficult path to travel. Some scrutiny,
questioning, discernment is necessary and important. For me it's the spirit of
this letter rather than the actual words that I aspire to. It keeps me vigilant
about my temptation to gossip, bad-mouth, speak without personal experience of
something or someone, turn my questioning into a personal attack, etc often
from a need to belong. If we have a common 'enemy' we are united, we belong.
This is where questioning can take on a life of its own and we can find
ourselves carried along by a set of belief systems we don't aspire to.
The whole thing comes full circle doesn't it! If I don't comment at all I can
escape all that and stay true to what feels right for me but others may
heartily disapprove of! And where do ethics fall in that?
I think inter-vision groups are a great idea but long term they risk falling
into collusive patterns unless from time to time there is SUPERvision from an
outside person or mentor. I subscribe to both and encourage it from the
beginning of the trainings I run.
We're back to conscience - personal, group and spiritual.
I think at the moment the constellations field is rich in its ability to allow
such a wealth of different approaches and opinions. I wouldn't want to see that
tightened in any way.
I remember Bert being asked why he didn't respond to the criticism he was
getting in the media. I don't remember his words precisely but it was something
like: "What for? They're just out to get me"
How do we know when our questioning and comments are 'clean' and can they ever
be fully?
Good wishes to all
Barbara
Sent from my iPhone
On 28 Apr 2017, at 01:23, Robert Grant erebees@xxxxxxxxx [ConstellationTalk]
<ConstellationTalk@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
Dear Barbara and All,
Thank you for the wonderfully pertinent and revealing quotation from Bert.
"Strife and division are necessary and inevitable. My advice to you is not to
comment upon the activities of others and not to allow other people's
comments to affect your own activities. That way you will have peace in all
that you do. As I work in this way too, I do not propose to comment on your
request."
And as you say “This letter had such a profound effect on me, I remember it
verbatim. Of course, I find it impossible to do wholeheartedly, but it is a
wonderful aspiration and very humbling,”
Indeed I do resonate with the suggestion that doing things the way it feels
right for us has merit, integrity and authenticity. Certainly doing things
against our own inclinations denotes an inner conflict. And it is very
possible to be lost in projections. There is however a measure of disquiet
about advice that recommends not to comment and not to listen to comments.
Somehow that kind of advice to me seems like a curtailment of open hearted
discussion and honest exchange of views. It is also staple diet in
authoritarian workplaces and countries. To me it feels like a necessary but
unfortunate need to avoid scrutiny and ultimately as you yourself observed a
futile attempt to wholeheartedly practice.
Of course we are all sensitive and maybe it is a natural inclination to shy
away from commenting and comments. Yet how are we to progress, to develop and
restore the flow of connection without honest exchange of views?
Kind regards to all,
Robert
-----------------------------------------------------
On Fri, Apr 28, 2017 at 1:01 AM, Barbara Morgan theknowingfield@xxxxxxxxx
[ConstellationTalk] <ConstellationTalk@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
Many thanks for your sharing Sneh. I do my best to subscribe to a similar
approach and as soon as I hear 'talk', whether shocking or otherwise, I urge
people to go and find out for themselves but even then, we can be in an
audience viewing an exchange, constellation, intervention etc and come to
our own conclusions which may in the end be completely at odds with what
actually transpires!
I would like to offer a quote from a letter I received from Bert 15-20 years
ago when I wrote asking for his help with difficulties we were experiencing
in the field of constellators here in the UK at the time. He said:
"Strife and division are necessary and inevitable. My advice to you is not
to comment upon the activities of others and not to allow other people's
comments to affect your own activities. That way you will have peace in all
that you do. As I work in this way too, I do not propose to comment on your
request."
This letter had such a profound effect on me, I remember it verbatim. Of
course, I find it impossible to do wholeheartedly, but it is a wonderful
aspiration and very humbling, as is Sneh's contribution about the outcome
for clients of constellations.
Warmly
Barbara
On 25 April 2017 at 17:45, Sneh Victoria sneh.victoria@xxxxxxxxx
[ConstellationTalk] <ConstellationTalk@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
Dear Maria, Elena, and all the others,
Precious sharing, I am touched it is happening.
Being german and „raised“ as a constellator in Germany during Bert
Hellinger’s high presence in Germany, living through the periods of high
acclaim and later high critisism, I have at times struggled with finding my
place in the field- not so much because of what Bert did or did not not do,
merely because my own personality, beliefs and findings have carried me in
different directions. When Bert started to work together with his wife, I
was already rather distant so did not pay much attention to how their work
proceeded. From time to time I met people I like and trust who took his and
Sofie’ s side, and at others times I met those who were shocked and
appalled. Both sides were right.
When I watched the piece of the Russian video with Sofie’s „intervention“ I
simply disliked it because it felt so not elegant and I value beauty in the
work a lot. (But I have seen many times colleges working with the absence
of beauty and having excellent results!) So me simply not liking what I see
has nothing to do with what the work can achieve. And and in this case the
outcome might speak for itself..
After so many years of working I came to the following conclusion: it does
not matter (at least not as much as we tend to believe) what the
therapist/facilitator is doing, it is the client who makes the move, it is
ultimately his or her decision- no matter what the facilitator is or is not
doing.
In this case, the energy surrounding the whole event had certainly made a
strong, probably unconscious impact. Many factors came together and created
the outcome, none solely by itself. It did not depend on Sofie’s skills or
lack of them (I also see what happened as Sofie and Bert having been
„caught“ by the constellation and became part of it), it mainly depended on
the clients themselves, there inner movements in life and at the time of
the seminar, their invisible connections to The Field, the family and the
presence of the group and Bert and Sofie.
I once many years back had a learning experience that I see reflected in
what happened in Russia: during a german conference in Würzburg, where the
earlier mentioned young woman from some african country was told by Bert to
go home if she ever wanted to find a husband, I myself sitting way back
from the stage, was shocked like my colleges in the seats next to me. (It
was the young woman Peter Levine later stated that he saw her pelvis relax
with Bert’s words)
After the constellation I met up with a college and friend who sat on the
stage during the process (that means as close to the constellation as one
can get) and told him how „not fitting“ I found Bert’s intervention. He
looked at me in surprise and said: "from here up on the stage it felt
totally right." My feelings had been with the young woman, thinking about
how horrible it must have felt to her, and so I was amazed when I saw her
during the lunch break in one of the shops I entered, chatting happily,
relaxed and with with obvious good feelings with a friend. It made me
rethink my quick judgement of the situation and I am a lot more careful now
to judge anything I see, be it at a distance or on film. There is something
about the energy field that can get lost, as soon as we are more removed
from what is happening.
(Later someone told me, that the young woman was already in a longtime
relationship with her boyfriend at that time...)
So, what I learned for myself is: when I am not present in person at a
situation, I might not get the full picture. I am happy that we in this
forum are taking the time to look at it, and become more clear in how we in
our groups and sessions want to work- and hopefully remain open to the
possibility of doing unusual actions in unusual situations- even if the
public opinion will judge it wrong.
Again, thank you all for sharing,
Sneh
--
Barbara Morgan
Family Constellations Trainer, Supervisor & Practitioner
Editor of
The Knowing Field
International Constellations Journal
www.cominghome.org.uk
www.theknowingfield.com
