[AR] Re: Braze joint design guidelines?

  • From: Henry Vanderbilt <hvanderbilt@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
  • To: arocket@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
  • Date: Thu, 8 Aug 2019 11:01:54 -0700

Not technically brazing, but I have some recent experience with copper-to-brass water pipe soldering that may be relevant.

Sort version, that used to be easy, using paste flux, lead-tin solder, and a propane torch.  Sand all mating surfaces to bright metal, flux thoroughly, assemble, heat, apply solder and watch it wick right in.  Piece o cake.  Even I used to be able to reliably do mechanically sound watertight joints.

Only, well, the authorities decided any lead at all in potable water systems is a bad idea.  Then I had to solder together some water pipes last winter using only the new approved materials. Disaster.  Exactly what you describe: Everything seemed to go OK, but the solder didn't wick into the slip joint region at all well.  After some reading, short version of the problem: The flux only has a few-degree effective window between melting temp of the new high-silver higher-temp solders and burnoff temp of the flux. Skilled pros with high-temp torches learn to hit that window.  Not me though in the time available.

The solution turned out to be, a mildly expensive metal-bearing flux.  Essentially flux with finely powdered silver solder in it. So you coat a joint with the flux and heat it, the powder melts and tins the inside of the joint, pre-wetting it, and even after you've hamhandedly burned off the flux,for a reasonable interval the externally applied solder will wick into that joint thoroughly and easily.

I don't know what braze alloy you're using or how high a finished-part operating temperature you require, but there may be some analogous metal bearing flux for that braze.  Or you may just be able to get away with using water-pipe metal bearing flux from the hardware store for the initial wetting and count on your braze material diffusing down to the mating surfaces.  (Or you could be looking at operating temps just fine for current water-pipe solders, in which case you're home free.)

Good luck!

Henry


On 8/8/2019 10:19 AM, Evan Daniel wrote:

We used a paste type flux. I applied the flux to all surfaces to be
joined before assembly. The solder appeared to my unpracticed eye to
wick in and around the joint during brazing. On inspection after the
failure, it seemed like I had good wicking action on most of the butt
joint contact area, but not on any of the slip joint area. I have no
good way to inspect the opposite side of the joint after assembly,
since that's inside the tiny chamber.

I added a fourth photo to the gallery, I think it shows that behavior
best. Here it is:
https://imgur.com/PHK2GMp

Evan

On Thu, Aug 8, 2019 at 1:05 PM Uwe Klein <uwe@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
Am 07.08.2019 um 19:06 schrieb Evan Daniel:
Does anyone have good resources to suggest for braze joint design guidelines?
Did you use some flux assist?

Good idea is to have visual check
for the solder wicking being successful.

Uwe




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