The figure 79 I'm talking about is in this article here
(https://luminous-landscape.com/red-river-palo-duro-softgloss-palo-duro-etching-san-gabriel-baryta-paper-review/).
Yves
On 12/16/2019 10:10 AM, graxx@xxxxxxxxxxxx wrote:
Elle vient d’où la “figure 79 »?
*From:* argyllcms-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx <argyllcms-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> *On Behalf Of *Yves Gauvreau
*Sent:* December 16, 2019 10:09 AM
*To:* argyllcms@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
*Subject:* [argyllcms] Re: Can we control the shadows (was black point compensation)
I'm not trying to print darker blacks, on whatever paper. This would be a humongous waste of time and resources.
I obviously don't use the same language as you guys it would seem.
On figure 79 on the left side in particular, for any input below L* 12 the output or print value I get is the almost the same at L* just above 16 (that's bad, a waste, etc). What I want is a way to make a profile that would print for the same input as on the left side, a response or a print value that increase as much as possible relative to increases in input values, just like on the graph on the right side of figure 79.
Regards,
Yves
On 12/16/2019 9:41 AM, Alan Goldhammer (Redacted sender agoldhammer for DMARC) wrote:
Printer manufacturers write drivers tailored to the papers they
sell. In many cases the papers are re-branded from major
suppliers. Unless you purchase a RIP, you are hostage to what the
printer manufacturer provides. Sometimes they will update
firmware and drivers as Canon recently did for Barayta papers,
providing a new setting that can be used. With my old Epson 3880
there were driver tools to adjust ink density within some limits.
I’ve not looked at my Canon Pro-1000 to see if the same feature is
available. Even with the Epson settings, I never found that I had
to do any adjusting and of course one will have to reprofile
everytime ink densities are changed to deal with potential color
shifts.
Some years ago, Scott Martin provided a nice test chart that
allows one to look at various paper settings and pick the best
setting. As he says, “Compare the final prints for maximum black
density (DMax), color gamut, shadow detail and dot smoothness.
You’ll want to choose the media selection that delivers the best
DMax without losing a significant amount of shadow detail (loosing
5% or less is OK), or without a course dot pattern caused by what
I call “micro pooling” (where dots touch due to excessive ink).”
You can find the print chart and further information here:
https://www.on-sight.com/how-to-determine-the-optimal-media-selection-for-any-paper/
this does what Greg describes in his email response to Yves. I’ve
used this chart over the years every time I try out a new paper.
In all but one case, I found the paper manufacturer’s suggested
settings to be the best one.
Ultimately, bringing out shadow detail is really a function of the
digital image processing. As I noted earlier and provided some
good references, soft proofing is a key part of this process. What
you see on your computer screen in the absence of soft proofing is
misleading as the screen gamut can be quite different from the
paper’s.
Alan
*From:* argyllcms-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
<mailto:argyllcms-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
[mailto:argyllcms-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] *On Behalf Of
*graxx@xxxxxxxxxxxx <mailto:graxx@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
*Sent:* Monday, December 16, 2019 8:43 AM
*To:* argyllcms@xxxxxxxxxxxxx <mailto:argyllcms@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
*Subject:* [argyllcms] Re: Can we control the shadows (was black
point compensation)
Thank you Greg. That’s the point I was trying to drive.
I know that “more ink volume” does not “necessarily” translate
into “higher dmax”, I know. There is a point of “diminishing
returns”, just as in micro-economics. Your suggestion to use a
small chart is right on the money.
/ Roger
*From:* argyllcms-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
<mailto:argyllcms-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
<argyllcms-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
<mailto:argyllcms-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>> *On Behalf Of *Greg E
*Sent:* December 16, 2019 8:38 AM
*To:* argyllcms@xxxxxxxxxxxxx <mailto:argyllcms@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
*Subject:* [argyllcms] Re: Can we control the shadows (was black
point compensation)
In the past I ran a printer on a real RIP, had control way past
normal ink volumes. More ink does not equate to darker dmax. In
reality once you go too far, the dmax starts to get lighter again.
Doesn't really answer the question of what the Canon driver will
let you send.
Also in the past, helping other people with their profiling, we
would have them print a small chart using several different
printer settings, selecting different types of paper in the
driver. Then you measure all the samples to find the one that gave
the best results and print the larger profile target. Since we
don't have control over ink limits, this is about the only way to
vary the amount if maximum ink on paper.
