Todd Westerhoff Wrote: > > Most commercial SI tools seem to measure flight times to the receiver's > input thresholds. Thus, for a given transition, they report a "min" and > "max" flight time based on the threshold settings. > . . > > My question is: what techniques are people predominantly using: the Vil/Vih > method, the reference voltage, or something in-between? > Dear Todd and others: I have also thought about ways of measuring flight times and concluded that the Vil/Vih method is preferable in many applications. When using XTK, I have explored two techniques for determining flight times of single ended and differential signals. One approach utilizes the driver to receiver network delays outputted by XNS in the Report (.rep), Interconnect Delay Data (.idd ) or General Report (.gen) files. However, the .rep results need to be examined for asterisk ( * ), as delay fields followed by asterisk indicate possible errors and can be unreliable. Another method is to measure delays on XNS Waveviewer window. The cursor can be used to ascertain the min/max rise and fall delays from intersection points of the rising and falling edges of the waveform and the receiver's low/high logic thresholds. Above procedurres are applicable to pre-route, post-route, single board and multi-board designs although, effects of TIME_TO_VM must be taken into consideration when appraising results of these methods. With V(m) correction Enabled, XNS will subtract driver TIME_TO_VM and report (in .idd, .rep, or .gen) the corrected delays. Subsequently, the values given in XNS report files can differ from those measured with the cursor. Furthermore, TIME_TO_VM correction (to prevent double counting of buffer intrinsic delay) can be essential when flight time values are intended for setup/hold timing margin computations. Logic thresholds influence the min/max propagation delay values. An IBIS model's logic low ( Vil ) and high ( Vih ) appear (after executing IBIS2XTK) as THRS: statements in Quad models. Verifying correctness of receiver thresholds is a good practice, particularly for devices having multiple thresholds such as SSTL logic with Vil (ac), Vil(dc), Vih(dc) and Vih(ac). The XNS simulation period (e.g. reciprocal of frequency) needs to be selected correctly. Please note that the data, address and control signals may switch at frequencies different from that of bus clock. For instance, when bus clock frequency is 100 MHz the data signals may operate at maximum frequency of 200 MHz (e.g. 2X interface). Therefore, in this example the optimum XNS period is 5nS (rather than 10nS) when simulating the data lines (The optimum simulation frequencies for various signals are often derived from the bus "timing diagrams"). A small XNS period may lead to a simulation where the flight time exceeds one half of period. It is then necessary that XNS option "Time of Flight for Delay" be Enable, in order to produce accurate timing results. I hope you find this information helpful. Best Regards, Abe Riazi ServerWorks ------------------------------------------------------------------ To unsubscribe from si-list: si-list-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx with 'unsubscribe' in the Subject field or to administer your membership from a web page, go to: //www.freelists.org/webpage/si-list For help: si-list-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx with 'help' in the Subject field List archives are viewable at: //www.freelists.org/archives/si-list or at our remote archives: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/si-list/messages Old (prior to June 6, 2001) list archives are viewable at: http://www.qsl.net/wb6tpu