In a message dated 12/17/2005 4:08:12 PM Central Standard Time, MarcatoGSD@xxxxxxx writes: And I interpret "The whole assembly of the thigh, viewed from the side, is broad, with both upper and lower thigh well muscled, forming as nearly as possible a right angle." To mean NEARLY a right angle, not EXACTLY as I see so many these days, which takes away from the structure of the dog, as they now have an excessive amount of thigh/stifle bone, which takes move time to move and follow through in the rear, and thus, there goes the drive, because the dog can't extend properly ------------------------------------------------------------ That passage in the standard absolutely does not mean achieving a right angle is faulty. If you are one-millionth of a degree away from 90 degrees, you are still not "as nearly as possible a right angle," and you could never see the difference between that and a perfect right angle. In fact, I've been taught that particular angle should be measured while the rear foot is under the hip socket. The dog in the picture you point to cannot even be considered for two reason. First, the handler side leg is way too far forward (enhancing the poor croup by the way), and in fact that dog's right leg has to be longer than its left leg in order to achieve the more extreme turn of stifle that it shows on the right leg, along with the lack of turn of stifle on the left leg. It's a mistake on the artist's part. Also ... Length of stifle does not have to cost drive. Muscle, ligament, and a good short hock can compensate for the longer leg bones. I agree that it is possible for those bones to be "too long," but that is always relative to the rest of the dog's structure. Tom Langlitz ============================================================================ POST is Copyrighted 2005. All material remains the property of the original author and of GSD Communication, Inc. NO REPRODUCTIONS or FORWARDS of any kind are permitted without prior permission of the original author AND of the Showgsd-l Management. ALL RIGHTS RESERVED. ALL PERSONS ARE ON NOTICE THAT THE FORWARDING, REPRODUCTION OR USE IN ANY MANNER OF ANY MATERIAL WHICH APPEARS ON SHOWGSD-L WITHOUT THE EXPRESS PERMISSION OF ALL PARTIES TO THE POST AND THE LIST MANAGEMENT IS EXPRESSLY FORBIDDEN, AND IS A VIOLATION OF LAW. VIOLATORS OF THIS PROHIBITION WILL BE PROSECUTED. For assistance, please contact the List Management at admin@xxxxxxxxxxxx VISIT OUR WEBSITE - http://www.showgsd.org ============================================================================