Echo, my soul mate, had a TERRIBLE temperament - shy. After I bought him, and he started showing his shy, "fear biting" type tendencies, I recalled his father showed similar characteristics. I was lucky, I spent hundreds of hours with Echo in obedience, socializing him, etc and he was able to over come his fear, shy temperament and by the time he was 7 people thought I was kidding when I told them about his early years. Yukon, on the other hand, had everything going against him. He was beaten, shot, tied to a tree with little or no shelter during a Manitoba winter, starved, and finally abandoned at an electric power plant (hydro). Fortunately for him, and eventually me, the 54 pound, 30" at the shoulder GSD was returned to his breeder thanks to CKC's mandatory ID's. Despite all that he went thru, he had a rock solid temperament with no hang-ups. His original family was good to him, but they gave him away when he was about 9 months old "because he ate too much" - it was at the second home where the abuse took place. If they had only returned him to his breeder he would have never suffered like he did. The only reason we know what happened was because the original family acted as an intermediary between the abusers and the breeder when we got his registrations back. I adopted Yukon when he was 18 months old and never regretted it for a single second. Gayle & the Hooligans! Ringer-Honey-Kelly-Mac-Slider-Bruiser Waiting at the Bridge: Andy-Abbey-Tasha-Tex-Echo-Yukon-JR-Too-Niki-Bo -- Barbara Galasso <uwish@xxxxxxxxxx> wrote: A breeder friend and I were talking about temperament of the GSD today. We were talking about what correct temperament was according to the standard looking for an approachable, but aloof personality. We talked about the outgoing "Golden Retriever" personality, the spooks, and then the aggressive and fear biters. Quite a range of temperaments, I'd say. I believe that a dog's temperament is determined by two factors. #1 - his genetics, his parents and grandparents having a great deal of influence on his temperament. And #2, I also believe environment plays a big role in our dogs personalities as well. If it's a genetic problem and you sell the dog into a good home, I believe he will still have a tendency to be what his genetics have dictated him to be. I believe we have all owned at one time or another different degrees of the above named temperaments. Some of the problem dogs you can work with and some can be trained to behave, or stand for examination. But genetically they are born to be what they were meant to be and will pass this along to their progeny. On the other hand, a puppy can be born with a good temperament and put it into a bad home, one who locks it up in a crate or kennel all day, doesn't socialize it, mistreats him by abusing him and he can become shy or suspicious of people. Or they may still like people, but are noise or object shy. I don't think (but, I'm not sure), that if you breed this animal that he will pass along a shy temperament if his was induced by a bad environment. I think when the public thinks of our GSD's as having mean and bad dispositions, they are not aware of how some of these dogs have been raised. I also know first hand that a dog can be born with a love of people and having been neglected, still love people. Also know of dogs who have been brought up in a kennel environment and haven't been anywhere and you take them and put them in a show and they're fine. Go figure. "Man made" or genetics? Best, Barbara Galasso ============================================================================ POST is Copyrighted 2005. All material remains the property of the original author and of GSD Communication, Inc. NO REPRODUCTIONS or FORWARDS of any kind are permitted without prior permission of the original author AND of the Showgsd-l Management. ALL RIGHTS RESERVED. ALL PERSONS ARE ON NOTICE THAT THE FORWARDING, REPRODUCTION OR USE IN ANY MANNER OF ANY MATERIAL WHICH APPEARS ON SHOWGSD-L WITHOUT THE EXPRESS PERMISSION OF ALL PARTIES TO THE POST AND THE LIST MANAGEMENT IS EXPRESSLY FORBIDDEN, AND IS A VIOLATION OF LAW. VIOLATORS OF THIS PROHIBITION WILL BE PROSECUTED. For assistance, please contact the List Management at admin@xxxxxxxxxxxx VISIT OUR WEBSITE - http://www.showgsd.org ============================================================================ ============================================================================ POST is Copyrighted 2005. All material remains the property of the original author and of GSD Communication, Inc. NO REPRODUCTIONS or FORWARDS of any kind are permitted without prior permission of the original author AND of the Showgsd-l Management. ALL RIGHTS RESERVED. ALL PERSONS ARE ON NOTICE THAT THE FORWARDING, REPRODUCTION OR USE IN ANY MANNER OF ANY MATERIAL WHICH APPEARS ON SHOWGSD-L WITHOUT THE EXPRESS PERMISSION OF ALL PARTIES TO THE POST AND THE LIST MANAGEMENT IS EXPRESSLY FORBIDDEN, AND IS A VIOLATION OF LAW. VIOLATORS OF THIS PROHIBITION WILL BE PROSECUTED. For assistance, please contact the List Management at admin@xxxxxxxxxxxx VISIT OUR WEBSITE - http://www.showgsd.org ============================================================================