[ SHOWGSD-L ] Re: Recruiting new fanciers
- From: Ann Mariano <brittaleahnasa@xxxxxxxxx>
- To: showgsd-l <showgsd-l@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
- Date: Fri, 9 Dec 2005 12:43:05 -0800 (PST)
Responses Below
--- RihadinK9@xxxxxxx wrote:
> The dog show scene has indeed changed, but I don't think
> the fault lies in
> the quality of our newcomers. I think it's in the way
> we do or don't welcome
> and encourage them.
I am considered a "newbie", since I have only been actively
showing about six years. When I first started there weree
SOME people out there that welcomed me and encourages them.
The problem is, many had a dog to sell me instead of
trying to help them with the one they have. This is a
good/bad thing depending on how you looked at. My first
girl was a German pet, I went to matches had fun. Went to
shows to watch/learn, read tons of books, talked to
everyone I could. I had some very nice people help me
learn. I realized that my girl was not "show" material, so
I went out looking for my next dog. Of course, my new
friends all had puppies to sell me. I did not go there,
since I wanted a dog outright, and I wanted a certain
"type". I got a half German bitch, which I was now told I
made a mistake. But to me, she was what I wanted in a dog
based on my research/learning. Was I wrong???
After getting her, more people were tryig to sell me dogs
that would be even better than the one I have. I even got
offered a bitch who later became a Se;lect. But i turned
her down due to what I felt was ridiculous contract (and
the person who did get her, and made her go Select is
crying about the contract due to the $$$ spent, and all the
puppies going back..thankfully I dinot go there)
Later when I was successful with my bitch who was "not"
suppose to turn out, my one friend/mentor dropped out of
the breed completely and we no longer talk (they had been
showing 8-9 years, and only ever gotten 2 points on any of
their dogs..their mentor had them tied down with puppy
back/contracts...and their dogs never finished..and they
HAD to breed to fulfill their contracts....talk about
discouraging for them, and with me sytarting to win, I
think they saw what had happened with their own
contracts/deal/mentor) I am so glad I never went down that
road, but do feel sorry for them since they really did wnat
to show and be succssful, just nevr happened. It seems the
longer I am in this, and the more you are successful the
less people talk/encourage/mentor you. This is
discouraging in itself, since you would think the people
who talked to you once would talk to you more, sicne they
were the ones who originally helped you in this breed.
There's a lot of "venting" on other
> show lists about how > veteran breeders have been done
wrong by novices and they're tired of "wasting their time"
and "no one wants to listen," etc. But you don't hear a
lot
> about what we can do to change that and you seldom hear
> anyone take responsibility. It's always "their" fault.
Vetreran breeders are what have made me STAY in this breed.
I remember the first time I showed my new girl myself (that
was not suppose to turn out due to her being half German).
She was in 6-9 under a breeder/judge. I won my class out
of 4 dogs..talk about a thrilll for a newbie. This
breeder/judge encouraged me everytime I showed her from
that day on. She never mentored me, but always encouraged
me and my girl which meant something earlyon to me.
When my girl was in the 9-12 class, I had a VERY well
known Specialy breeder/judge give me their card afterwards
(after I went 2 out of 2). They told me I should have won
my class, and if I learned how to present mey girl she
would be hard to beat. After a few months, getting
frustrated showing, I thought about it, and called them.
Best call I ever made. She never lost her class after
that, first time witha handler, she won her first Major.
Singled out with 1 Major by 2 years old. She is now a
Champion.
Would I have stuck in it for that long without the help and
encouragement from this judge, and other mentors I had met
along the way...doubt it.
Do I alway take their advice? No. Do I upset my mentor at
times? Yes. But I always listen,a nd I alwas weigh what I
know for myself to be true, and take their advice when I
feel it matches what "I" want in a dog. Thankfully they
put up with me <VBG> My first litter, I had my mentors help
evaluate the litter. My main mentor choose a girl
different then the one I wanted, but I did not think her
personality matched my household so I kept my pick :)
Thankfully they stood behind me when I told them, and
helped me train her as well as get a top handler (mind you
it DOES help to have old timers help you with contacting
handlers).
When I went to her Futurity later on, only people I had met
out the local All Breeds talked to me. Noone new, none of
the "Specialty people". I was there two days and before she
was shown, I had only talked to maybe 4-5 people. up going
R/BIF later on (with my mentors help with training her, and
putting me in contact with a top handler). When she won I
had a alot of well known judges congratualte me. Of course
I also got some fdirty looks by some other judges/known
people in the breed. But it was nice that there were some
nice people who congratulated me after her win even though
they did not know me at all.
Later, I showed her myself (against my mentors advice), and
got tons and tons of Reserves on her. Was my mentor upset?
Did they keeping drilling me on how I NEED a handler, YES.
Did I FINALLY listen. YES. Did my mentor stick with me
despite me going against their advice..YES....Wehn I did
finally listen ad got a handler, she finished in 6 shows,
(2) 5 point Majors/Breed over Specials.
>
> For every mentor I've known who has been let down by a
> novice, I've known four or five novices who have been
completely put off showing by so-called mentors taking
advantage, treating them badly, and putting them off
showing and > breeding entirely. I think it's time we
admitted that we have some serious problems with our
recruiting program and figured out what to do about it.
I agree with this. I know many many newbies who were told
that "winner" under contracts with 2-4-6 puppy backs. Dog
does not turn out, BUT tehy STILL have to breed them per
their contract. I know one girl who went to many judges
looking for a dog, but they did not have what "she"
wthought was her ideal dog or the contract was not what she
wanted. So she kept looking. She ended up getting a dog
from a handler who when she told them this is not what she
wanted, they told her, THIS IS WHAT SHE WANTS, she just
does not KNOW enough to know what she is looking at (may be
true). She got the 8 week old pup since the handler knew
what was best (though many people tried telling her an 8
week old is too young to tell, but she thought this handler
knew best). Now the dog is 7 months old, a borderline
coat, weak ears. She will not part with her, and the
handler who was suppose to train her/show her really has
stopped contact. So now a person who REALLY REALLY wants
to show is going to show a dog that "may" be a coat, with a
weak ear. Talk about discouraging.
>
> We've all seen the rudeness, the brush-offs, the snobbery
> at shows. It's there.
Very true. I think I have less people talk to me then when
I first started. Had shis made me want to quit at
times..YES>>>YES>>Will you see me less at shows>>>YES
But I will still show :):) and am thankful to those who
still talk and encourage me sicne they are truly my "true"
friends.
I remeber a show recently when a pup I bred/co-own was
pulled up for WD, later went BOB over Specials. I had an
exhibitor say "Not again, I can't belive this *** pulling
up a puppy.****" I was standing right next to them. This
person USE to always talk to me, and tell me whow much they
loved this pup's mom, you would think they would be happy
for me. Now I am lucky if I get a hello.
They were complained loudly about this boy's win ring side.
But you know what this pup is now singled out at 8 months
old, and has several Breeds. Talk about getting dirty
looks. Talk about very few people telling me congrats when
I am at one of the shows he is at/and wins.
Is it my fault I picked an owner who I knew would show the
dog and do well "if" the dog turned out? Am I too new to
have this much success?
Do I keep my mouth shut at ring side. Yes :) sicne I know
if I didn't I would be considered a "know it all" which
trust me I AM NOT, and I am just thankful that I have been
fortunate this early on to have this much sucess.
And I think we've all heard examples of
> incredibly unfair puppy
> contracts presented to novices (who are often told they
> are "standard" and "this is
> what it takes to get a nice show puppy.")
I know when I first started I heard this time and time
over. Not good. I was fortunate with my first "show"
bitch I was TOLD she was a PROMISE at 4 1/2 months old, and
she "may" not turn out, and I would be better off getting
an older dog 1-year or over. To me this is honesty, and I
took the long shot since atleast I knew the breeder would
help me learn along the way instead of just sell me a pup,
and foregt about me.
And for those who have that 8-10 week old supersatar (IMO)
they are only looking for the "sale" without the newbies
best intreste at heart.
> And I can't tell you how many people I've talked to who
> showed their dogs once or twice, were treated horribly
-- or totally ignored -- by people at ringside, and will
never show again. Don't tell me they have to be "tough"
to show. We have a habit in this hobby of blaming the
victim. "If you can't take the heat, get out of the
kitchen."
This is true. There are a few "new" people I see now and
again who I always say Hi to. It seems noone talks to
them, and they are out showing their own dogs. Recently
there was a guy who showed in Novice, won the class and
left. Noone had told him you had to stay for Winners, noone
even talked to him. But boy did you hear people COMPLAIN
taht he left and did not go in for Winners. The next day I
made it a point to talk to him, and explained how shows
work. He said noone had ever told him that before, and he
siad noone ever talked to him before and thanked me for
telling him, since he thought you only went in to win a
class. He was showing for fun, and said after this weekend
he doubts he will be back sicne the people did not seem
that nice. (I learned this had been his 5-6th show) he is
not the first newbie I have run into that has said this
either. very sad.
> The more serious problem is that these same people who
> come away from dog > shows believing we are all a bunch
of condescending, rude elitists are not going to be eager
to help us defeat anti-breeding legislation. In fact, a
lot
> of them will be happy to support it. They won't realize
> these laws will > eventually make it impossible to find
a healthy pet;> they're just going to hear > the word
"breeder" and shudder at the memory of their brief
excursion into the
> dog show world.
Agreed. This needs to be changed.
> Questions: How did dog showing become such a wasp nest?
> What can we do to encourage new fanciers? Can our
parent clubs/all-breed clubs help? How about AKC and UKC?
Dog shows are a game, and I think the newbies need to learn
HOW TO PLAY THE GAME. I think All Breed and Specialty
clubs need to get more people involved. My own thoughts
which I would do now, and definately would have done when I
was new, is to have the clubs to have short training
sessions after a show.
For example, have a handling class (no charge) for those
who want to show their onw dogs, in CONJUNCTION with the
show. Possibly afterwards after BOB. This way newbies can
learn ring procedure, and possibly how to present their
dog.
Or they could have a grooming session AFTER (or during) a
show to help people learn wahat they ned to do to groom
their Shepherd correctly. (ie. the girl I first started
with thought Shepherds could only be bathed ONCE a year,
noone ever told her about bathing before show, or what a
full force dryer was)
Have short seminars at shows on what makes a good dog (pf
course this is opinion)
Maybe if newbies ahd a better idea what to do/look for,
they would want to stay and try to learn more
And can we turn
> this around?
Hopefully the answer is yes :)
Ann Marie
www.geocities.com/amarigermanshepherds/Puppies.html
Home of CH Fairway's Leah v Nadelwald TC OFA
and her daughter R/Best In Futurity CH Amari's Ava Gardner OFA
and in the wings Leah's new daughter Amari's Beware of Foxy Roxy
Breeder/Owner ofAmari's Bandit of Broadcreek (5pts. 2/BOB @ 6 months)
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