Re: game development question:reading and writing game data to and from files

In my DataDraw based system, if I want to save or load a
mysqldump-like version of my data, it's 1 line of code.  It's similar
if I prefer a binary dump.

The fact that C++, Java, and other languages don't have this simple
feature blows me away.  How hard is it to auto-traverse your data and
print it to a file, and to load that same file later?  I'm amazed at
the waste of effort and time programmers spend on this automatible
task.

Anyway, for the vast majority of programmers without such simple
solutions available, here's what I recommend.  Print your data to a
file.  If flex/bison is too complex, then use fscanf.  It's really
that simple.  Extra credit if you make your save file a list of
commands that recreate your data when executed.

Bill

On Mon, Jul 13, 2009 at 1:45 AM, black
ares<matematicianu2003@xxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
> it sounds some how as an over engineered system.
>
> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Bill Cox" <waywardgeek@xxxxxxxxx>
> To: <programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> Sent: Sunday, July 12, 2009 10:39 PM
> Subject: Re: game development question:reading and writing game data to and
> from files
>
>
> So long as we're talking about some more esoteric stuff, I'll go ahead
> and describe how I actually deal with saving data.  However, be
> warned, it will make your brain hurt.
>
> I do a semi-object-oriented style of C, based on a database code
> generator I maintain at datadraw.sf.net.  It keeps all the data
> in-memory rather than on disk, and has an interface somewhat like
> mysql, but with speed that's faster than plain C.  When I want to
> save, I have the database manager write out an ASCII database, similar
> to what you get with mysqldump.  As users take actions that modify the
> database, I log the commands that modified it to a log file, so to get
> to the current state, I load the ASCII database, and replay the log
> file.  If I wanted all this automated, I'd use a persistent DataDraw
> database, but I prefer the version where I replay commands from the
> log file.
>
> I would recommend you don't do what I do.  It's way cooler and more
> efficient and easier in the long run to deal with than a Mysql
> database, but then again, I wrote the DataDraw tool, and am the
> leading expert in it's use.
>
> For multiple users interacting with a server, I use a simple tool I
> wrote called Command Serialiser, at comserial.sf.net.  It allows
> front-end tools (typically in PHP for web pages) to connect in a way
> similar to mysql.  My back-end engine reads commands from it one at a
> time, so it can be single threaded, and uses a simple console style
> command interface.  The overall architecture, I feel, is far more
> secure, many times faster, and easier to write and maintain than
> typical LAMP applications.  However, LAMP runs the world.  My system
> currently runs only one web site, and learning it will turn you into
> an alien.
>
> On Sun, Jul 12, 2009 at 3:16 PM, black
> ares<matematicianu2003@xxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>>
>> xml files is all he needs.
>>
>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Rui Batista"
>> <ruiandrebatista@xxxxxxxxx>
>> To: <programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>> Sent: Sunday, July 12, 2009 9:17 PM
>> Subject: Re: game development question:reading and writing game data to
>> and
>> from files
>>
>>
>>> Why don't you use DBM files or sqlite or something?
>>>
>>> Flex/bison/parsing-almost-from-scratch stuff is better to do things more
>>> complex then that, like programming languages, complex configuration
>>> files, Etc... You are just saving data I think.
>>>
>>> Just my to cents.
>>>
>>> Best regards,
>>>
>>> Rui Batista
>>> Dom, 2009-07-12 às 10:50 -0600, Tyler Littlefield escreveu:
>>>>
>>>> I like that idea. Do you have any good resources for bison? I've tried a
>>>> few
>>>> times and never managed to understand how it works all that well.
>>>>
>>>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Bill Cox" <waywardgeek@xxxxxxxxx>
>>>> To: <programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>>>> Sent: Sunday, July 12, 2009 10:48 AM
>>>> Subject: Re: game development question:reading and writing game data to
>>>> and
>>>> from files
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> In general, for complex databases, I prefer to write custom
>>>> reader/writers using bison/flex. An ASCII file that mirrors your
>>>> classes well has many advantages. You can edit it easily, and it's
>>>> fairly simple to maintain backwards compatibility with previous
>>>> versions.
>>>>
>>>> Bill
>>>>
>>>> On Sun, Jul 12, 2009 at 12:39 PM, Tyler Littlefield<tyler@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>>>> wrote:
>>>> > hmm, so I would store the pointer to an int/string/double.
>>>> > I need to be able to tell what it is though, no?
>>>> >
>>>> > ----- Original Message ----- From: "Sina Bahram" <sbahram@xxxxxxxxx>
>>>> > To: <programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>>>> > Sent: Sunday, July 12, 2009 10:36 AM
>>>> > Subject: RE: game development question:reading and writing game data >
>>>> > to
>>>> > and
>>>> > from files
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> >> The map definitely handles this bro.
>>>> >>
>>>> >> Just don't make it a map of primative to primative, make it a map of
>>>> >> primative to object. That object can be of any type you like.
>>>> >>
>>>> >> Take care,
>>>> >> Sina
>>>> >>
>>>> >> ________________________________
>>>> >>
>>>> >> From: programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>>> >> [mailto:programmingblind-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Tyler
>>>> >> Littlefield
>>>> >> Sent: Sunday, July 12, 2009 12:18 PM
>>>> >> To: programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>>> >> Subject: game development question:reading and writing game data to
>>>> >> >>  >>
>>>> >> and
>>>> >> from
>>>> >> files
>>>> >>
>>>> >>
>>>> >> Hello all,
>>>> >> I've started work on a custom mud, and am trying to figure something
>>>> >> >> out.
>>>> >> Each player will have a set of keys that will be stored, name, >>
>>>> >> connect
>>>> >> time,
>>>> >> creation time, etc.
>>>> >> I was thinking of storing these in a map, but that requires that the
>>>> >> >> map
>>>> >> hold multiple values; something which the c++ map doesn't do.
>>>> >> So, I'm trying to figure something out.
>>>> >> I'd like to be able to store player data, and a list of the player's
>>>> >> inventory so the objects can be recreated when the player connects
>>>> >> somehow.
>>>> >> I would need to store object type, name, etc etc.
>>>> >> I'm not quite sure how I could achieve this easily; I could possibly
>>>> >> itterate through the map once I've gotten the data type thing figured
>>>> >> >> out
>>>> >> and do something like write key=value.
>>>> >> Then when I loaded it I could just strtok on the = and set that up,
>>>> >> >>  >>
>>>> >> but
>>>> >> I'm
>>>> >> not quite sure how I'd handle inventory and that.
>>>> >> This is the only snag I'm having so far, and I'm not able to move on
>>>> >> without
>>>> >> it, as I'm to the point where I need to start saving player data, so
>>>> >> >> help
>>>> >> would be really appriciated at this point. :)
>>>> >> Thanks,
>>>> >>
>>>> >> __________
>>>> >> View the list's information and change your settings at
>>>> >> http://www.freelists.org/list/programmingblind
>>>> >>
>>>> >
>>>> > __________
>>>> > View the list's information and change your settings at
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>>>> >
>>>> __________
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>>>> __________
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>>>>
>>> Rui Batista
>>> E-mail/googletalk: ruiandrebatista (at) gmail (dot) com
>>> MSN/WLM: ruiandrebatista (at) hotmail (dot) com (don't send mail to this
>>> on)
>>> Skype: ruiandrebatista
>>> twitter: http://twitter.com/ragb
>>> weblog: http://outputstream.wordpress.com
>>>
>>> __________
>>> View the list's information and change your settings at
>>> http://www.freelists.org/list/programmingblind
>>>
>>
>> __________
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>>
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>
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