Brian: >> Let me give you an example: last month Ursula wrote how "grateful to Canada" >> she is and that she feels she gave her "kids the gift of Canadianess." But >> then she ended with "There is so much that is wonderful about America. But >> it's presence in the world today is harmful to me and mine" and not one >> person challenged that notion. Not one person on this list stood up and >> said hey its great you like Canada but I love America, and how exactly is >> America's presence in the world harmful? << Let me give you some examples: The war in Iraq. The Patriot Act. The war in Iraq. Extreme Rendition. The war in Iraq. Abu Ghraib. The war in Iraq. Guantanamo. The war in Iraq. Lying to the American people. The war in Iraq. Unbridled arrogance and duplicity at the UN. The war in Iraq. Abandonment of the citizens of New Orleans. Refusal to sign the Kyoto Treaty. Economic pandering to the the super wealthy. Failure to honor AIDS commitments. The attempt to steal Social Security from the people and turn it over to Wall Street. The assault on the wall between Church and State. The sitting on hands while the Sudan commits genocide in Darfur. There are many more things but I think you might get the idea why Ursula and many people like me agree with Ursula. America has lost it's way under this Administration even more than -- much more than -- under Lyndon Johnson with his disastrous war. At least Johnson was for the people, not for corporate greed. Had it not been for Vietnam, I'd count Johnson as one of America's best Presidents. But Bush and his administration I believe to be harmful to America even if there had never been his criminal invasion of Iraq. Hope this helps. Mike Geary Memphis There is one issue on which I agree with Bush and admire his leadership -- that of immigration. Astonishingly, he has stood against his base and party to champion poor and desperate people -- or he's kissing the ass of the corporate employers who need their labor. My good nature makes me choose the former. ----- Original Message ----- From: Brian To: lit-ideas@xxxxxxxxxxxxx Sent: Friday, December 15, 2006 6:10 PM Subject: [lit-ideas] Re: The Left Only Exists In Lawrence's Head So there is little if any distinction, which is what I believe. For heaven's sake The New York Times calls The Nation - the flagship journal of American radicalism - a "liberal" magazine. What I find dissonant is there has been talk on the list about people being called Leftists when they are liberals but where are these liberals? Let me give you an example: last month Ursula wrote how "grateful to Canada" she is and that she feels she gave her "kids the gift of Canadianess." But then she ended with "There is so much that is wonderful about America. But it's presence in the world today is harmful to me and mine" and not one person challenged that notion. Not one person on this list stood up and said hey its great you like Canada but I love America, and how exactly is America's presence in the world harmful? Certainly an old-style liberal can want change in the country but still pledge allegiance and affection to it, while the Leftist is a globalist with contempt for red America's nationalist sentiment. ~Brian On Dec 15, 2006, at 11:00 AM, Mike Geary wrote: A leftist is a politically active liberal -- that's my distinction.