Re: [JFW] jaws with that attitude of yours:
- From: James <james@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
- To: jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
- Date: Sun, 27 Jun 2004 22:28:46 -0400
I somehow don't think it'll get to the point where linux use will be a
thing to switch to. Though admitedly I wouldn't mind seeing a few
proffessional companies take a trip into the linux operating system as far
as screen readers go. However, in the meantime, I still operate on the
theory that JFW is only as accessible as you make it, the same with any
other program. There are programs out there, for instance, where while a
script may not be the thing that's called for for making JFW more
accessible, a minor adjustment in your JFW settings, or even the program
you're trying to use, will accomplish just as much if not more than any
assigned set of hotkeys will. I cite as my example the telnet.exe
application that comes with Windows, all versions. While admitedly the
program interfaces are extremely different between, say Windows 98/ME and
Windows 2000/Xp, the method of enabling nearly complete accessibility
between JFW and that program remains overall the same. This is of course
assuming you are aware of how to use this program, as the XP version is
also command line based. Also, and many will find this the same as well,
particularly when dealing with programs that JFW should be reading messages
for you as soon as they come in, we'll take MSN Messenger for instance,
even with the scripts in place, a minor change to your JFW settings for
that program specifically is in order just so you don't miss information.
Meaning, while you will hear when someone IMs you while you aren't typing,
if someone sends you something while you're in the middle of typing a
message, as many will likely profess having happened to them, you will
subsequently miss it, possibly not even knowing it's been sent to you, and
then they're waiting for a reply to that message as well. Again, a problem
easily solved by making another minor adjustment in JFW settings. The long
and short of it is this: if a program isn't currrently accessible with JFW,
don't immediately assume it's because there are no scripts available for
it... you're only hurting yourself in doing that. From someone who's been
fiddling with settings and looking for ways to make programs like
Telnet.exe accessible siince JFW 2.0, I'm fairly sure you're the only
person who can set the limit of a program's accessibility 99% of the time.
James
At 09:57 PM 27/06/2004, you wrote:
>Yes, I remember the days of DOS well, and although DOS was very accessible
>being a text based operating system, it now seems as archaic as dinosaurs
>compared with today's systems with multimedia, the internet and many other
>advancements and this is only the beginning. David made a good point on the
>complexity of using a screen reader for people that don't have a technical
>background. I wonder if some day Jaws will have 1000 hotkeys for Internet
>Explorer, and if there is, who will learn them all and keep them floating in
>there mind. I've also noticed a gradual decrease in accessibility in Windows
>operating systems leading up to XP and I'm concerned about what lies ahead.
>Maybe down the road we'll be using Linux or something else.
>
>As far as Jaws and Window Eyes goes, I've used them both and I think the
>competition between them can only spur them on to improve their products.
>
>Dean Schmidt
>
>----- Original Message -----
>From: "Angelo Sonnesso" <asonnesso@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>To: <jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>Sent: Su nday, June 27, 2004 10:06 AM
>Subject: Re: jaws with that attitude of yours:
>
>
> > Frankly I remember that ASAW beat Jaws to the windows platform, but once
>JFW
> > started it just snowballed.
> > I believe that window bridge was also one of the first if not the first.
> > They had this slick transition from dos to windows so a blind person could
> > do their own installations.
> > They are both gone, and Jaws and Windoweye are keeping up the good fight.
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "david poehlman" <poehlman1@xxxxxxxxxxx>
> > To: "jfw users email list" <jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> > Sent: Sunday, June 27, 2004 9:21 AM
> > Subject: jaws with that attitude of yours:
> >
> >
> > > Remember the good old days when we were crawling out of dos into
>windows?
> > > Well, some of you will I'm sure. Remember how jaws shaped the way
>screen
> > > reading and interacting with the computer was done and how it was all
> > brand
> > > new, frustrating, exciting and challenging and how it opened up a whole
> > new
> > > world albiet it slowly to us and how it closed it again and then opened
> > and
> > > closed it again? Well, some of you will I'm sure.
> > >
> > > We now live in a world where jaws is concerned where those of us who use
> > > jaws are dictated to by it what software and in some cases, hardware we
> > can
> > > use even though there is a lot out there that we could use if only...
>We
> > > also live in a world where jaws is concerned that though the learning
> > curve
> > > is steep and in some cases even too steep for some with a technical bent
> > to
> > > climb, we have tremendous power at our finger tips.
> > >
> > > I'll take this last bit first and stop along the way to my main poiint
>to
> > > say that I well remember the use of the jaws cursor for doing a lot of
> > > things that could not be done in any other way. One of my tests with
>jaws
> > > was to find ways to do as much as possible without the jaws cursor or
> > custom
> > > scripts. Now though it seems that there are people who want scripts for
> > > things that jaws can already do because of either a lack of
>understanding
> > > that jaws can do them or a lack of willingness to apply the power of
>jaws
> > to
> > > get it to work for them. This attitude has to change. Folk, we need to
> > > work smarter with jaws than to want a script or some special
>customization
> > > to do something that jaws can already do for us if we are to really get
> > our
> > > time and money's worth out of it. This is a fact in that if we take the
> > > approach that everything needs to be scripted we will limit ourselves to
> > far
> > > less than that which we can achieve with the current and growing power
>of
> > > jaws. Rather than asking if there is a script for this or that or can
> > this
> > > be scripted, First, find out if there are good ways to do things without
> > > scripting. Do this because if you go to a computer that does not have
>the
> > > script for what you want to do and it can be done, or if you loose the
> > > script you will be able to do it. I know there is a lot that needs to
>be
> > > scripted and other wise customized from within and with jaws and I'm
> > getting
> > > to that but this is one of the most powerfull ways to approach jaws that
> > > there is. If efficiency is what you require and there is no approach
> > > besides scripting that achieves that efficiency than I'd say that
> > > customization is called for but I have found little that can be done
>with
> > > jaws without scripting that needs to be scripted for the sake of
> > efficiency.
> > > jaws has a lot of power and if you don't know how much power it has,
>just
> > > read its documentation, listen to its new features cds, explore the web
> > > site. If you are concerned with a particular environment such as office
> > or
> > > the internet, learn about all that jaws has to offer in that environment
> > > from the resources provided including this list.
> > >
> > > We are faced with a shrinking world who use jaws while others are moving
> > to
> > > broader and broader horizons and I hope this will be noticed by fs and
> > > corrected as soon as possible. We need access to mozilla, netscape,
> > opera,
> > > better access to java application suites and many many more. If we
>don't
> > > get this access, we will be looking else where for our access so that it
> > can
> > > be provided to us. This is the way of the world and the market place.
>We
> > > are now at a cross roads as we were when windows became usable by those
> > with
> > > screen readers in that it is becoming increasingly possible for screen
> > > readers to interact with other platforms. I'm not even sure that the
>next
> > > itteration of windows will be as accessible as this one is. It seems
>that
> > > even though they are accessible, each new itteration of windows becomes
> > less
> > > accessible in some ways and this is certainly true of many other
>microsoft
> > > products which is what jaws seems to be primarily focused on. So, like
>it
> > > or not, those of you who see a long future of screen reading ahead for
>you
> > > will find yourself increasingly looking for alternatives to what you
>have
> > > and the potentially less than what you have now than what you will have.
> > >
> > > I will stay with jaws as long as possible, but when you look around for
> > > where to migrate, I'll most likely be there too. I have always and will
> > > continue to strive for excellence in the use of jaws and will continue
>too
> > > help those who wish to achieve that excellence at no cost to the best of
> > my
> > > ability. When you find your self migrating to a new environment, if I
>can
> > > help, I will. Amazing things are happening and I hope we can all enjoy
> > them
> > > together for as astounding as jaws is and it is becoming even more
> > > astounding with each new itteration enriching its feature set and
> > providing
> > > access in ways we never thought possible, the face of screen reading and
> > > interacting with the computer will change forever in the not too distant
> > > future.
> > >
> > > David Poehlman
> > > poehlman1@xxxxxxxxxxx
> > >
> > >
> > > --
> > > To post a message to the list, send it to jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> > > To unsubscribe from this mailing list, send a message to
> > jfw-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx with the word unsubscribe in the subject line.
> > > Archives located at: //www.freelists.org/archives/jfw
> > >
> > > If you have any concerns about the list, post received from the list, or
> > the way the list is being run, do not post them to the list. Rather
>contact
> > the list owner at jfw-admins@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> > >
> >
> >
> > --
> > To post a message to the list, send it to jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> > To unsubscribe from this mailing list, send a message to
>jfw-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx with the word unsubscribe in the subject line.
> > Archives located at: //www.freelists.org/archives/jfw
> >
> > If you have any concerns about the list, post received from the list, or
>the way the list is being run, do not post them to the list. Rather contact
>the list owner at jfw-admins@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> >
>
>
> >
>
>
>--
>To post a message to the list, send it to jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>To unsubscribe from this mailing list, send a message to
>jfw-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx with the word unsubscribe in the subject line.
>Archives located at: //www.freelists.org/archives/jfw
>
>If you have any concerns about the list, post received from the list, or
>the way the list is being run, do not post them to the list. Rather
>contact the list owner at jfw-admins@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx
--
To post a message to the list, send it to jfw@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
To unsubscribe from this mailing list, send a message to
jfw-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx with the word unsubscribe in the subject line.
Archives located at: //www.freelists.org/archives/jfw
If you have any concerns about the list, post received from the list, or the
way the list is being run, do not post them to the list. Rather contact the
list owner at jfw-admins@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Other related posts:
