Re: Any progress on Amazon?

I ordered a giftfor an american friend yesterday from amazon.com. Using the list-of-links method of ordering the product took me, perhaps, on the outside, twenty-five seconds longer than it would have otherwise, thanks to first-letter navigation. Part of the problem is that no two blind people can agree on what "accessible" means. to me, "accessible" means "can you do it without sighted asistance?" Obviously, you subscribe to a different view of what accessibility means, which is fine. But what is the legal view?

Bruce

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Bruce Toews
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On Sat, 26 Nov 2005, Adrian Spratt wrote:

Bruce,

It's useful to inject a note of realism into how we analyze what we expect from websites and Freedom Scientific. From Amazon's point of view, you make a fair point that the ability of WindowEyes to handle their website suggests that they are meeting minimal web design accessibility standards. However, while we need to be reasonable as JAWS users, we shouldn't take reasonableness to an extreme, if you'll forgive the oxymoron. I don't agree with you that use of the insert-F7 links list command is quick and easy. It is less quick and easy than navigation of the Amazon website was before the recent design change. If WindowEyes were also unable to navigate Amazon, this substitute navigation method would be unacceptable.

We must always hold web designers accountable for failures of accessibility. In cases where JAWS cannot properly access a website but Windoweyes can, we must pressure FS for a better and faster response than we are getting here and that we got in the New York Times situation.

As an aside, JAWS still provides full access to the UK website, if users are prepared to pay international shipping rates, sometimes offset by some good pricing at that website. In rough terms, 1 pound sterling equals $1.80. Here's the web address:
www.amazon.uk.co
----- Original Message ----- From: "Bruce Toews" <DogRiver@xxxxxxxx>



 If I'm Amazon, here's what I'm thinking, when I'm thinking about this at
 all. Two major screen readers, one has a problem withour site, another
 doesn't. What we did benefits 99.5% of our users, i.e., users with sight.
 Of the remaining people, many use the screen reader that doesn't have a
 problem with our site changes. It's not our fault if the other screen
 reader can't handle the change. I think they'd have a good point here. FS
 is not to blame for this problem, but they are completely responsible for
 the fix, in my view. amazon has no obligation to remove an enhancement to
 their site which they obviously feel is worth something to them and the
 majority of their users. And if you're a JAWS user, the method of turning
 off the virtual cursor, hitting insert+F7 for the list of links, then
 finding the link you need is a quick and easy solution to the problem
 until FS gets things sorted out on their end.

 Bruce

 --
 Bruce Toews
 E-mail and MSN/Windows Messenger: DogRiver@xxxxxxxx
 Web Site (including info on my weekly commentaries): http://www.ogts.net
 Info on the Best TV Show of All Time: http://www.cornergas.com

 On Sat, 26 Nov 2005, Jim Portillo wrote:

> Howdy,
> Just wondering if there has been any progress with talking to the Amazon > folks.
> I've been making some phone calls, but they just don't seem to > understand some of the problems we're encountering as blind folks, > because they don't understand about screen reading software.
> > I have gone to the
> www.amazon.com/access
> site, but that seems very limited because I can't do things like sell > items, look at my account, wish lists, etc.
> If anyone has figured out more or better ways, I'd appreciate some info.
> Jim
>
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